Railway Observations for 2022.

Sydney / New South Wales Transport Discussion
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Transtopic
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Re: Railway Observations for 2022.

Post by Transtopic »

boronia wrote: Tue Jan 25, 2022 4:31 pm Oscars same dimensions as the D sets?
Yes, the same. Length (4 car set) - 81.55m; width - 3,034mm; height - 4,402mm (D) 4,403mm (H). They've already tested the D sets to Lithgow, so not sure what's going on there.
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gilberations
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Re: Railway Observations for 2022.

Post by gilberations »

That H set performed perfectly back in November. It was doing ATP testing, however you won’t see them in service up there until if/when they qualify Mt Victoria or Lithgow crews as Sydney Drivers take a meal break before returning, even though the guard does not.
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Re: Railway Observations for 2022.

Post by Glen »

Now you've got me curious. Why do Sydney drivers take a meal but guards do not?
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gilberations
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Re: Railway Observations for 2022.

Post by gilberations »

Glen wrote: Fri Jan 28, 2022 1:41 pm Now you've got me curious. Why do Sydney drivers take a meal but guards do not?
Suburban Guards and Drivers have a meal break
Intercity Drivers have a meal break but Guards do not.
The justification is that guards are better off financially without one as it allows them to qualify for Mileage payments and a shorter shift when they go up and back straight away, whereas if they have a meal break it would lengthen their shift but they may no longer qualify for a mileage payment as their shift length would be longer than the payment.
Further justification for this is that intercity drivers work just as hard if not harder than suburban drivers, but intercity guards tend to get a break on board in the form of longer distances between platforms, where they can eat a meal.
As a former guard who worked both, I can say that the only time it didn’t work out was peak south coast services where from Sutherland the trip was basically a suburban service all stops to Wollongong, or in the evening all stops from Port Kembla to Bondi Junction, however in diagrams where that is the working, you’d get a gap between trains at Wollongong that was as long if not longer than a meal break, and the turn around time at Port Kembla was almost the length of a meal break anyway. The south coast shifts are usually done so that a Sydney guard is always relieved at Wollongong, even if they continue south on the next service.

Intercity turn around times are longer than suburban trains too. Where they are done so to allow for a down service delay to not delay the up service. That time is usually 15-20 mins. So long as you don’t have a delay that’s enough time to heat something up whilst changing ends. I also used to use the trick of having food delivered to the station staff who would usually bring it to me as well :)

Hope that clears it up.
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Re: Railway Observations for 2022.

Post by Glen »

Thanks for that very detailed explanation.
It's interesting to hear that mileage payments still apply.
Isn't that a relic of steam days?
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Re: Railway Observations for 2022.

Post by tonyp »

Glen wrote: Sat Jan 29, 2022 12:00 pm Thanks for that very detailed explanation.
It's interesting to hear that mileage payments still apply.
Isn't that a relic of steam days?
Interesting reading all that when at the same time I was reading an article in the current ARHS Bulletin on the Timboon goods in Victoria in the 1960s. It mentions crew breaks and the author recalled that they got their lunch break at the Timboon pub and one driver used to have a drink too many and they'd shovel him in the guards van to sleep it off while the guard and fireman would drive the train (steam) back to the main line. I guess the procedures are a little different nowadays!

In the same issue, a detailed analysis of the NSWGR 1972 timetable which I possess myself. It was to be the swansong of the NSWGR and the last great decade of train travel in the state. Many memories of train services I rode in that one. Also the last timetable to publish the names and direct phone numbers of all the senior officers of the railways, before the public service sank onto cowardly anonymity and the spin doctors took over.

When I was in Czech Republic several years back, I noted that government agencies there still have the same practice. You can even contact a department head on their direct number. I see it as a sign of the strength of a democracy.
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gilberations
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Re: Railway Observations for 2022.

Post by gilberations »

tonyp wrote: Sat Jan 29, 2022 7:47 pm It mentions crew breaks and the author recalled that they got their lunch break at the Timboon pub and one driver used to have a drink too many and they'd shovel him in the guards van to sleep it off while the guard and fireman would drive the train (steam) back to the main line.
I can assure you the same thing used to happen in Sydney/NSW as well back in the day. These days though, you’ll never see it happen.
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boronia
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Re: Railway Observations for 2022.

Post by boronia »

I noticed a V set on the 07.15 Central-Newcastle service today. This has previously been an Oscar diagram since the weekend timetable was extended.
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Re: Railway Observations for 2022

Post by Linto63 »

With school now back and the need for some services to be strengthened to 8 carriages there was always going to be need for some V sets to return to Newcastle services.
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Re: Railway Observations for 2022.

Post by tonyp »

boronia wrote: Tue Feb 01, 2022 11:18 am I noticed a V set on the 07.15 Central-Newcastle service today. This has previously been an Oscar diagram since the weekend timetable was extended.
A comfortable trip to Newcastle! That would be like winning lotto nowadays.
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Re: Railway Observations for 2022.

Post by Glen »

gilberations wrote: Sun Jan 30, 2022 2:45 am
tonyp wrote: Sat Jan 29, 2022 7:47 pm It mentions crew breaks and the author recalled that they got their lunch break at the Timboon pub and one driver used to have a drink too many and they'd shovel him in the guards van to sleep it off while the guard and fireman would drive the train (steam) back to the main line.
I can assure you the same thing used to happen in Sydney/NSW as well back in the day. These days though, you’ll never see it happen.
I could tell you about about passengers riding on the 1720 class catwalk, or in the cab, whilst the engineman roamed the carriages talking to the tourists as the fireman drove 'The Last Great Train Ride' from Cairns to Forsayth, and that was quite a bit later than the 1960's ..... however that would not be a "Railway Observation for 2022." :D
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Re: Railway Observations for 2022

Post by ACM »

Linto63 wrote: Tue Feb 01, 2022 12:37 pm With school now back and the need for some services to be strengthened to 8 carriages there was always going to be need for some V sets to return to Newcastle services.
If only we could go back to a full weekday timetable. I see suburban trains going past my local halt - most in anything that could vaguely be considered peak hour are with at least one passenger per bench - not quite 'covid safe'. But at least all of them wear masks..... (sarcasm)
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Re: Railway Observations for 2022.

Post by Special_K »

Glen wrote: Wed Feb 02, 2022 12:13 am
gilberations wrote: Sun Jan 30, 2022 2:45 am

I can assure you the same thing used to happen in Sydney/NSW as well back in the day. These days though, you’ll never see it happen.
I could tell you about about passengers riding on the 1720 class catwalk, or in the cab, whilst the engineman roamed the carriages talking to the tourists as the fireman drove 'The Last Great Train Ride' from Cairns to Forsayth, and that was quite a bit later than the 1960's ..... however that would not be a "Railway Observation for 2022." :D
Hi Glen, At the risk of diverting from Current Topics, our family rode on the same mentioned Cairns-Forsayth goods with several passenger cars attached in September 1993. Cab rides, gorge swims with freshwater crocs and battered utes emerging from the bush to pick up fencing wire, groceries and ice cream were all part of the trip!

Enough of such nonsense. No wonder we became transport planners! Will have to focus on NSW/Sydney memories to stay on target.

Now, who has ever ridden behind a 30 class tank on the Carlingford goods.............................?
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Re: Railway Observations for 2022.

Post by boronia »

Back in the 1960-70s, one of my school friends was a junior driver at Eveleigh. Spent many nights shunting at Darling Harbour, or on the "Carriage Works Express" doing midnight post-refurbishment trials with a 30T or 32 hauling 2 or 3 carriages from Redfern out to Penrith and back.
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Re: Railway Observations for 2022.

Post by TSE_SecretAni »

4 of 8 car Millennium out today

Run 2 - M24 + M20
Run 825 - M16 + M4
Run 830 - swapped from B14 to M10 + M11
Run 83 - M14 + M5
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Re: Railway Observations for 2022.

Post by BAMBAM »

Both Waratah A and B Sets running to Hurstville today due to network issues where there are no train service between Turella and Glenfield.
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Re: Railway Observations for 2022.

Post by ACM »

https://transportnsw.info/news/2022/ind ... n-services

6th to 21st feb
reduced timetable short notice cancellations blah blah blah
anyone know the full story?
BAMBAM
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Re: Railway Observations for 2022.

Post by BAMBAM »

Did you even read your own link :roll:

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Glen
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Re: Railway Observations for 2022.

Post by Glen »

Not only potential.

Last week a signaller went sick and they (the Union) would not work overtime to replace them so the entire T8 got shut down.

https://www.goulburnpost.com.au/story/7 ... ke-action/
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Re: Railway Observations for 2022.

Post by Aurora »

There is a two week ban on overtime, therefore the organisation needs to run with what it has, which incidentally should be positive from a strict labour cost standpoint.
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Re: Railway Observations for 2022.

Post by Campbelltown busboy »

The RTBU are now putting up posters at stations saying that the government want to “privatise the rail network” that’s what I picked up from the poster I saw at Liverpool today. Has the government ever suggested a planed proposal for privatisation of the rail network
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Re: Railway Observations for 2022.

Post by boronia »

The RTBU has been running scare campaigns about "selling the buses", about the metro conversion of T3, the introduction of Emeralds on F1; so this is likely to be just as false.

None the less, the government once promised it was never going to outsource all the STA regions, and looked what happened. The metro contract is a "foot-in-the door" opportunity.
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Re: Railway Observations for 2022.

Post by Glen »

Aurora wrote: Sun Feb 13, 2022 11:59 pm There is a two week ban on overtime, therefore the organisation needs to run with what it has, which incidentally should be positive from a strict labour cost standpoint.
Indeed......... until a signaller goes sick on the T8.
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gilberations
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Re: Railway Observations for 2022.

Post by gilberations »

The railway runs on the good will of its staff to work overtime. What other industry is anyone expected to work overtime every single week. We are talking about working with only 1 day off every 2 weeks sometimes. Yes they get paid for it, but a failed business operation due to an overtime ban is proof of understaffing.
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Re: Railway Observations for 2022.

Post by Glen »

Why don't they employ more staff?

Surely that would be cheaper on ordinary time rates.
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