Adblue shortage

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TP1462
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Adblue shortage

Post by TP1462 »

According to the Australian there is a global shortage of a key adblue ingredient it’s unclear what implications this would have on the transperth network and day to day running of operations considering over half the fleet is euro 5/6 compliant and use adblue. Obviously the PTA would have a stockpile however that wouldn’t be infinite

Thousands of freight trucks and family cars could be forced off the roads within weeks over shortages of a special anti-pollution ­additive for diesel vehicles – a move that threatens to smash the nation’s already strained supply chain.
Australia’s trucking industry has warned shortages of diesel ­exhaust fluid this summer could cause up to half of all trucks to be removed from the road by early next year because of global shortages in one of its key ingredients.
Advisers from Deputy Prime Minister Barnaby Joyce’s office are set to be told on Friday by the industry that unless the government acts decisively on the shortage, there will be a cascading impact across the country, also ­affecting the agricultural and power sectors which rely heavily on diesel motors.
Urea, which can be used as a fertiliser and feed supplement, makes up a third of DEF, which is injected into the exhaust system to reduce the amount of pollution entering the atmosphere.
But the supply, mainly from China has been slashed, leading to global shortages.
National Road Transport Association chief executive Warren Clark said DEF was at risk of becoming the industry’s toilet paper, with many businesses rushing to buy stock ahead of an expected collapse in supply.
“It is a massive supply chain issue,” he said, warning that the product was being bought in bulk by many Australian users.
“We are talking about a supply chain that’s really under stress at the moment.”
The NRTA estimates up to half of all diesel trucks could be garaged because of the shortfall, with vehicles unable to operate legally without the emissions controls; it is also fraught to try to circumvent the diesel exhaust cleaning systems because there is no guarantee vehicles will operate properly or components won’t be damaged.
The Australian Trucking Association has warned stakeholders the issue will become “much worse by February”. The ATA said many businesses had started stockpiling and buying bulk storage containers to hold the fluid in the event of a crushing shortage.
A spokesman for Mr Joyce said: “The government is aware of the concerns around the supply and availability of (DEF) and is continuing to monitor the situation.”
“We encourage industry operators to continue operating as they normally would.’’
Video: Key Supply-Chain Link Faces Perfect Storm This Holiday Shopping Season
Mr Clark said the industry had learned of the supply problems last month, warning the knock-on ­effect for the economy could be dire if large parts of the national trucking fleet was forced off the road. He said the issue would be profound for businesses across the country, and action needed to be taken by the federal government.
The Department of Prime Minister and Cabinet has been alerted to the issue and has been told that there should be a ban on urea exports from Australia
The ATA said the overwhelming majority of the Asia-Pacific’s supply of suitable urea came from China, amid suggestions China has almost halted urea exports as part of an attempt to cool down its domestic fertiliser prices.
Some modern diesel cars also require the product, with the latest Euro 6 standards demanding a two-thirds drop in nitrogen oxide in the emissions of diesel cars.
DEF, which trades under the name AdBlue, enables the process that targets a vehicle’s nitrogen oxide, with sensors in the exhaust system monitoring the pollution levels. When it’s needed, a spray of DEF is then injected into the exhaust system.
Viva Energy, which provides fuel to about 1300 Shell and Liberty service stations, said it was aware of the global shortage of DEF. Brenntag Australia, which imports the product to Australia, was unable to comment.
A diesel exhaust fluid shortage in South Korea already has raised doubts over the supply chain in Asia’s fourth-largest economy.
The lack of the liquid has undermined the domestic logistics sector, raising concerns about what might happen in a country such as Australia.
A diesel car may not start unless the DEF is replenished in time. There also have been price spikes in the US and Europe amid fears about urea supplies.

https://apple.news/AavoaG3wQShWWe3MkislvkA


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Merc1107
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Re: Adblue shortage

Post by Merc1107 »

TP1462 wrote: Fri Dec 03, 2021 6:22 pm According to the Australian there is a global shortage of a key adblue ingredient it’s unclear what implications this would have on the transperth network and day to day running of operations considering over half the fleet is euro 5/6 compliant and use adblue. Obviously the PTA would have a stockpile however that wouldn’t be infinite
I notice a lot of the withdrawn OCs (including the earliest withdrawals at the start of the year) are still registered, so perhaps there is an opportunity there to get around this in the short term. Are there many stored NHs left in the fleet, though?

Unless they're planning to cancel service, are there many accessible, non-AdBlue buses suitable for urban work around?
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Re: Adblue shortage

Post by Enviro 500 »

Those using pre-€6 VW diesel engines can breathe easy. €5 and below MAN and Scania buses didn't have AdBlue.
pasha241
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Re: Adblue shortage

Post by pasha241 »

Merc1107 wrote: Fri Dec 03, 2021 8:07 pm
TP1462 wrote: Fri Dec 03, 2021 6:22 pm According to the Australian there is a global shortage of a key adblue ingredient it’s unclear what implications this would have on the transperth network and day to day running of operations considering over half the fleet is euro 5/6 compliant and use adblue. Obviously the PTA would have a stockpile however that wouldn’t be infinite
I notice a lot of the withdrawn OCs (including the earliest withdrawals at the start of the year) are still registered, so perhaps there is an opportunity there to get around this in the short term. Are there many stored NHs left in the fleet, though?

Unless they're planning to cancel service, are there many accessible, non-AdBlue buses suitable for urban work around?
yeah i was thinking that also. and remember that in christmas there will be big disruptions for Mandurah line. so unless they bring Stored NH i dont think (that not even include this)
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sylar
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Re: Adblue shortage

Post by sylar »

This is just an estimate based on my records, there is approximatley 60x 0405NHs and 40x OC500LE CNGs in storage across the metro area depots. The registration expiry periods for these units range from 31/03/22, 30/06/22 and 30/09/22.
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Re: Adblue shortage

Post by Bus Suggestions »

Merc1107 wrote: Fri Dec 03, 2021 8:07 pmUnless they're planning to cancel service, are there many accessible, non-AdBlue buses suitable for urban work around?
Stored OCs could be temporarily re-activated, until their tanks expire. As sylar says, there are still quite a few NHs stored around Perth which could be brought back on an emergency basis. Freo/Rockingham tender documents list 11 NHs parked up at Freo and 5 at Rocky.
I'd post any important, bus-related links I had, but they're outdated anyways.
LawBayly
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Re: Adblue shortage

Post by LawBayly »

I think the big question is how long will the shortage go on for. As far as I can tell there are no actions being taken to address the shortfall. (at least none that the media have reported on)
The PTA have in the past have converted busses to use alternative fuels in the past, nothing to say they can't do it again.
https://www.mediastatements.wa.gov.au/P ... ciple.aspx
Of course the economics need to be there for them to do that though, if they are able to source enough to supply most of the diesel fleet and extend the life of the CNG fleet to reduce their use of Adblue they probably will.
The other option is to get an exception from the Govt & Volvo so they can run the busses without Adblue, in all honesty a B7RLE is likely still more environmentally friendly running without AdBlue than an O405NH which doesn't use Adblue. Of course running such a bus without Adblue might clog up filters.
There is no way they can't not use diesel busses, as they only have 3 articulated CNG busses in the fleet, so probably a good idea to prioritize Adblue for the artics so they may be used when needed.
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TP1462
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Re: Adblue shortage

Post by TP1462 »

LawBayly wrote:I think the big question is how long will the shortage go on for. As far as I can tell there are no actions being taken to address the shortfall. (at least none that the media have reported on)
The PTA have in the past have converted busses to use alternative fuels in the past, nothing to say they can't do it again.
https://www.mediastatements.wa.gov.au/P ... ciple.aspx
Of course the economics need to be there for them to do that though, if they are able to source enough to supply most of the diesel fleet and extend the life of the CNG fleet to reduce their use of Adblue they probably will.
The other option is to get an exception from the Govt & Volvo so they can run the busses without Adblue, in all honesty a B7RLE is likely still more environmentally friendly running without AdBlue than an O405NH which doesn't use Adblue. Of course running such a bus without Adblue might clog up filters.
There is no way they can't not use diesel busses, as they only have 3 articulated CNG busses in the fleet, so probably a good idea to prioritize Adblue for the artics so they may be used when needed.
I don’t see why it wouldn’t be possible to run a diesel without adblue however it may require a remap or tune of the ECU or engine management to prevent them from going into limp mode. running lean using more fuel and being less efficient and reliable or breaking down this would definitely require approval or information from Volvo to make sure it won’t damage the engines and affect the warranties. I totally agree there is absolutely no way they can’t run the weekday service without the diesel fleet I can imagine PTA would have a stockpile in the depots but with over 1000 buses requiring adblue maintaining mid or long term supply would be tricky not sure if running a Sunday timetable would be an option until the supply issue is addressed given we don’t really know how long it’s going to last


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Re: Adblue shortage

Post by Merc1107 »

LawBayly wrote: Tue Dec 07, 2021 12:52 pm The PTA have in the past have converted busses to use alternative fuels in the past, nothing to say they can't do it again.
https://www.mediastatements.wa.gov.au/P ... ciple.aspx
As it turned out, only a small handful were ever converted, a group of O305s and less than a dozen Renaults.

There's some details on the Internet Archive (Metrobus Mail?) documenting the terrible mean time between failure of these converted buses (as the O305s in particular were already a decade or so old).

Of course these days you might just go and buy a new gas engine rather than trying to make a diesel into something it isn't meant to be.
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Re: Adblue shortage

Post by Campbelltown busboy »

This Adblue shortage thread should be moved to the general discussion as it's a problem affecting euro 5 and euro 6 route buses across Australia
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Re: Adblue shortage

Post by Enviro 500 »

Campbelltown busboy wrote: Fri Dec 10, 2021 2:53 pm This Adblue shortage thread should be moved to the general discussion as it's a problem affecting euro 5 and euro 6 route buses across Australia
Not the Scania KUBs or MAN A22s. These didn't require AdBlue until €6 kicked in. Volvo and Mercedes, on the other hand…
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Re: Adblue shortage

Post by Stonesourscotty »

Sydney channel 7 reported 2 weeks of the product used to make adblue en route on the Friday 6pm news bulletin
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Re: Adblue shortage

Post by eddy »

There were so many drivers broken down with the burn on Freightliners the Americans made it law to put the instructions on the back of the sunvisor and I really suggest drivers get their head around it before they get behind the wheel of one.
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Re: Adblue shortage

Post by Enviro 500 »

Freightliner using Cummins engine am I correct?
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Re: Adblue shortage

Post by eddy »

Enviro 500 wrote: Sat Dec 11, 2021 3:26 pm Freightliner using Cummins engine am I correct?

I am unsure, we hired one when our Hino was off the road and while I had no trouble it broke down on the other driver and that is when I researched it on line and found about this law.

Suppose I was just lucky as you had to put the brake on and off,in and out of gear etc,etc and stop in a safe place when the red light comes on where there is no grass and stop immediatly if the light flashes but all this was a long while ago but if we run out of Adblue I would think many of these old bangers would be hired.
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Re: Adblue shortage

Post by Bus-1809 »

eddy wrote: Sat Dec 11, 2021 5:08 pm

I am unsure, we hired one when our Hino was off the road and while I had no trouble it broke down on the other driver and that is when I researched it on line and found about this law.

Suppose I was just lucky as you had to put the brake on and off,in and out of gear etc,etc and stop in a safe place when the red light comes on where there is no grass and stop immediatly if the light flashes but all this was a long while ago but if we run out of Adblue I would think many of these old bangers would be hired.
[/quote]

That's a Diesel Particulate Filter Burn System. Coasters and Rosa's have them. Light comes on, stop bus, put in Park or Neutral and press button until engine revs raise... Allow bus to do it's burn. When bus returns to idle speed, then you are good to go.

The DPF burn system gets the exhaust quite hot, so hence why you can't park on grass etc... B8's burn off as well as having AdBlue, however they do it automatically I believe.
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eddy
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Re: Adblue shortage

Post by eddy »

Bus-1809 wrote: Sun Dec 12, 2021 1:00 pm
eddy wrote: Sat Dec 11, 2021 5:08 pm

I am unsure, we hired one when our Hino was off the road and while I had no trouble it broke down on the other driver and that is when I researched it on line and found about this law.

Suppose I was just lucky as you had to put the brake on and off,in and out of gear etc,etc and stop in a safe place when the red light comes on where there is no grass and stop immediatly if the light flashes but all this was a long while ago but if we run out of Adblue I would think many of these old bangers would be hired.
That's a Diesel Particulate Filter Burn System. Coasters and Rosa's have them. Light comes on, stop bus, put in Park or Neutral and press button until engine revs raise... Allow bus to do it's burn. When bus returns to idle speed, then you are good to go.

The DPF burn system gets the exhaust quite hot, so hence why you can't park on grass etc... B8's burn off as well as having AdBlue, however they do it automatically I believe.
[/quote]

They may have got it a bit smarter now instead of brake on/off/on gear in/out etc. etc. but thanks, I think the little Hinos are like that too.
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