Newcastle light rail, renewal & integrated transport

Sydney / New South Wales Transport Discussion
tonyp
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Re: Newcastle light rail, renewal & integrated transport

Post by tonyp »

lunchbox
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Re: Newcastle light rail, renewal & integrated transport

Post by lunchbox »

And no advertising crap on the windows!
Glen
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Re: Newcastle light rail, renewal & integrated transport

Post by Glen »

lunchbox wrote:And no advertising crap on the windows!
Well if it's wire free to avoid 'ugly wires', it's the least they can do to keep the windows for what they were meant for, to see out of! :D
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Re: Newcastle light rail, renewal & integrated transport

Post by boronia »

lunchbox wrote:And no advertising crap on the windows!
Yet!!

It will only take a month or so to get a value on exposure levels.
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Re: Newcastle light rail, renewal & integrated transport

Post by Swift »

tonyp wrote:Some good positive news:

https://www.nbnnews.com.au/2019/02/18/t ... -journeys/
You wouldn't want it to be much more popular. Just as well it isn't full of those pesky seats. An insight into CSELR.
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Re: Newcastle light rail, renewal & integrated transport

Post by mandonov »

Standing room only on all the services I used today, with most seats occupied at the first stop in both directions. The triathlon was on, but it didn't look like many people were actually going to it. Queen's Wharf and the termini were by far the busiest stops.

A few of the stops had Opal machines that didn't have single trip tickets available. The KD staff just directed people to use contactless instead.
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Re: Newcastle light rail, renewal & integrated transport

Post by Swift »

Another success story on a new light rail system.
Even a system following an old forgotten goods railway suffers from "failed popularity management" in the peaks.
Australians are thirsty for efficient public transport and we have corrupt governments who have refused to provide. Obsessed with pleasing personal friends and assorted insidious special interests.
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tonyp
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Re: Newcastle light rail, renewal & integrated transport

Post by tonyp »

Is there a detailed plan of the bus interchange as opposed to the vague artists impressions on the government website?
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Re: Newcastle light rail, renewal & integrated transport

Post by mandonov »

Civic Station is now behind hoardings for its transformation as part of the new Museum Place: https://www.hccdc.nsw.gov.au/museum-place-civic

Image

Image
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Re: Newcastle light rail, renewal & integrated transport

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The reality never lives up to the romanticised artist's rendering or scale model presented. It just results in a clean environment devoid of feel or character. Australian urban planners love to alter everything to the point it's unrecognisable, wiping out a sense of tradition and continuity in the community. too much changes too soon in Sydney and surrounds, except maybe Gosford. That was too much of a time-warp until recently. Nowe it's set to rapidly change like everywhere else. If only we got the balance right. I have a feeling New Zealand knows how to progress without drastic change. Then again, they do plenty better than us.
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tonyp
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Re: Newcastle light rail, renewal & integrated transport

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New Zealand is a hole.

That render really brings home the vision behind removing the rail line.
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Re: Newcastle light rail, renewal & integrated transport

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Ah those pesky urban planners!
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Re: Newcastle light rail, renewal & integrated transport

Post by Swift »

tonyp wrote:New Zealand is a hole.
Seen their countryside before? And we can certainly take a few leaves out of their book, but we're too sure of ourselves to ever contemplate that. Our collective loss.
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Re: Newcastle light rail, renewal & integrated transport

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Note the bulk coal carrier in Newcastle Harbour. Is somebody having a lend of us......?
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Re: Newcastle light rail, renewal & integrated transport

Post by Merc1107 »

Swift wrote:he reality never lives up to the romanticised artist's rendering or scale model presented. It just results in a clean environment devoid of feel or character. Australian urban planners love to alter everything to the point it's unrecognisable, wiping out a sense of tradition and continuity in the community.
It also seems they're quite fond of creating concrete jungles. There aren't many new or newish suburbs (or recent re-developments in the city; i.e. Perth CityLink) I've been to where trees and greenery (beyond some fake lawn) are given any consideration these days... And we wonder why air quality is increasingly becoming a problem!?
tonyp
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Re: Newcastle light rail, renewal & integrated transport

Post by tonyp »

Should have seen Civic workshops and the port beforehand. Completely industrial, not exactly a place of beauty when active.

Edit: what's also not much visible in that render is that the 19th century railway workshops have been restored and they look quite beautiful.
tonyp
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Re: Newcastle light rail, renewal & integrated transport

Post by tonyp »

Rode the tram today. The good quality videos being posted of some of these transport journeys tell one a lot already, so I wasn't really surprised by anything. The major "real life" observations are:

The development opening up the waterfront post rail line is, like, Wow!! It was the right thing to do for Newcastle.

There's a hell of a long way between doors on the trams. I haven't been on IWLR in the big crowds that are common as I understand, but the lack of doors must make these CAFs as dysfunctional as a Sydney bus. Truly dumb decision to delete doors.

I was riding uncrowded Saturday afternoon services but it was still popular. Dwells were in the range of 5 to 15 seconds and recharge time was as expected in the range 40 to 55 seconds, so the recharges added about two to 2.5 minutes to each journey over and above the passenger exchange time. Really dumb technology.

Traffic light priority is excellent. The trams are slow but not a great issue on this service. You wouldn't want to be rushing for a train, between this slowness and the recharges, you'd have apoplexy - but let's face it, no worse than our buses are run.

It will be easy to extend (returning to Hunter St at the western end of the bus terminal I'd say), but they've stuffed themselves with that power system as the trams can't run on wires, so on any suburban run you'd have those excruciating waits at every stop. Needs taking back to the drawing board for a technology reboot.
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Re: Newcastle light rail, renewal & integrated transport

Post by Glen »

tonyp wrote:The trams are slow but not a great issue on this service. You wouldn't want to be rushing for a train, between this slowness and the recharges, you'd have apoplexy - but let's face it, no worse than our buses are run.
On that subject, they do not appear to have timetabled the trams to meet the (Sydney) trains anyway.

Throughout the weekday off-peak the waits are 7 - 9 minutes on all connections both ways. You can't actually get much worse than that on a 10 minute frequency.

On weekends the transfer time varies between 10 and 15 minutes, worst at night.

How is this a replacement for the train?
Last edited by Glen on Sat Mar 02, 2019 11:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.
tonyp
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Re: Newcastle light rail, renewal & integrated transport

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When you ride it Glen you realise that it's something the train never was, a very busy internal circulator - and it's not too bad for train users too. The train didn't stop at Honeysuckle and Queens wharf and there is no traditional CBD for Newcastle station to serve any longer. Newcastle has completely changed and is now a multi-centred city.
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Re: Newcastle light rail, renewal & integrated transport

Post by Glen »

tonyp wrote:When you ride it Glen you realise that it's something the train never was, a very busy internal circulator - and it's not too bad for train users too. The train didn't stop at Honeysuckle and Queens wharf and there is no traditional CBD for Newcastle station to serve any longer. Newcastle has completely changed and is now a multi-centred city.
Yes agree with that.

On weekdays at least it does have frequency on its side, so if a train arrives late there will be another tram soon.

No doubt when the extra vehicle arrives it should get better.

An interesting review by The Herald in Newcastle:

https://www.theherald.com.au/story/5907 ... t-couldnt/
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Re: Newcastle light rail, renewal & integrated transport

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Not every passenger arriving in Newcastle is terminating their journey in the old CBD.

It doesn't affect them if they can make the same transfer to another mode at the Intg instead of the old station.

I just keep reminding N/c whingers that if they come to Sydney to visit our CBD, they have most likely have been transferring to another transport mode at Central for years
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Re: Newcastle light rail, renewal & integrated transport

Post by Swift »

Thank heavens the traffic priority is there, because it likes a good dawdling session between it's long dwells at stops. I like the Honeysuckle stop name. Very quirky.
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Re: Newcastle light rail, renewal & integrated transport

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lunchbox wrote:And no advertising crap on the windows!
Very good rumour it was booked for all over wrap, the government told company to change date to after election :shock: :shock:
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Re: Newcastle light rail, renewal & integrated transport

Post by Swift »

So fully aware it's hated but persist.
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tonyp
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Re: Newcastle light rail, renewal & integrated transport

Post by tonyp »

I should mention that yesterday there were no trains. There was a bustitution stop on the other side of Hunter St. Nevertheless a lot of passengers boarded and alighted from the tram at the station terminus stop.
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