Inner West Light Rail observations

[alleve]

Oh yeah, the L1 is packed. The extra 4 trams the Govt bought won't be enough. They'll need more

The next step before that can happen is to upgrade the capacity of the line and rectify the silly mistakes they made when they built it - notably the fact that Central has the capacity to turn a tram around every 30 seconds, while Dulwich Hill can only turn one around every 4-5 minutes. In theory, some could reverse at Lilyfield, but I'm not sure that they have the capability to do that like clockwork.

IIRC the existing plan to get these extra 4 trams they've ordered running is to have them terminate at Lilyfield. Should be fine for 4 of the trams to do that, but if they order more again it'll stop being a workable solution and they'll have to take the plunge and upgrade the line.

IIRC Dulwich Hill terminus + power supply limits the line to 6 or 8 tph (don't remember which).

If they order more (and eventually they'll have to), they should order them with the same door configuration as on the PLR.

The massive cost blow out of L2/3 is a wonderful device to prevent more lines being built, while being able to say we have trams again, all's well. The NSW sausage machine continues as planned.

Not exactly. There's a great political push to built the Parramatta Light Rail, especially stage 2.

[Linto63]

The next step before that can happen is to upgrade the capacity of the line and rectify the silly mistakes they made when they built it - notably the fact that Central has the capacity to turn a tram around every 30 seconds, while Dulwich Hill can only turn one around every 4-5 minutes. In theory, some could reverse at Lilyfield, but I'm not sure that they have the capability to do that like clockwork.

Patronage at the western end of the line doesn't justify a service level requiring Dulwich Hill to be duplicated, the overcrowding is at the other end of the line. There is space at Lewisham for a turnback siding to be built.

[boronia]

Oh yeah, the L1 is packed. The extra 4 trams the Govt bought won't be enough. They'll need more

The next step before that can happen is to upgrade the capacity of the line and rectify the silly mistakes they made when they built it - notably the fact that Central has the capacity to turn a tram around every 30 seconds, while Dulwich Hill can only turn one around every 4-5 minutes. In theory, some could reverse at Lilyfield, but I'm not sure that they have the capability to do that like clockwork.

There is a shunting neck (for the workshop access) which could be used as a turnback facility.

[Swift]

Why haven't they taken advantage of them yet?

[alleve]

Why haven't they taken advantage of them yet?

The new trams haven't come into service yet and the existing terminus can handle the amount of trams that currently operate the line

[boronia]

I notice closures being planned for 7-10 July weekend. L1 truncated DH to Exhibition (with replacement buses) and L2/3 terminating at Chalmers St (make other arrangements) .
Wondering if they are planning work on the George/Hay Sts crossing?

[boronia]

At Dulwich Hill this afternoon, I noticed the PID mentioning that 10 minute daytime frequency services now operating.

After one tram left, the indicator changed to show "next service 3 minutes", then counted down to 1 minute which remained until the tram left 7 minutes later.

I don't understand how Transdev can't get these displays to work properly.

[Merc1107]

After one tram left, the indicator changed to show "next service 3 minutes", then counted down to 1 minute which remained until the tram left 7 minutes later.

I don't understand how Transdev can't get these displays to work properly.

All the technological marvels of 2023 and something this insignificant is simply impossible.

[Stonesourscotty]

Cracks have been found in further CAF stock with 2 Mark5a Sets in the Uk discovered today at Trans Penine Express.

[boronia]

Report on Ch 9 news that two trams collided on the Colonnade this afternoon. Both appeared to be Citadis, one was 041.

[Swift]

Cracks have been found in further CAF stock with 2 Mark5a Sets in the Uk discovered today at Trans Penine Express.

I wonder if they've studied our experience with them here?

[moa999]

Cracks have been found in further CAF stock with 2 Mark5a Sets in the Uk discovered today at Trans Penine Express.

These are trains, so other than being made by CAF, not sure of much relevance.

[matthewg]

These are trains, so other than being made by CAF, not sure of much relevance.

CAF appears to have QC issues with welding - it doesn't matter whether it is heavy or light rail, they are having high-stress parts break off. However CAF are not the only manufacturer having issues - Hitachi Rail Europe (ex Breda) has parts break off too. On heavy rail it appears to be yaw-dampers that they have underestimated the stresses they are subjected to. On the Urbos trams, they seem to have cracked in the high-stress part of the bogie mounts.

CAF says they have 'fixed' the Urbos issue by switching to aluminium alloy frames - but I thought aluminium alloys were harder to weld properly than steel. I hope they did their yield strength calculations correctly and that their AL welders are better than their steel welders.

[tonyp]

You'd hope that they'd learn from bad experiences, though Breda never did, so anything's possible. Based on experience with automobiles and other inanimate objects, I wouldn't buy anything made in Italy or Spain.

[Swift]

You'd hope that they'd learn from bad experiences, though Breda never did, so anything's possible. Based on experience with automobiles and other inanimate objects, I wouldn't buy anything made in Italy or Spain.

Just look at what Fiat's done to Chrysler products.
Taken it the other way from Mercedes Benz days, and as with cars, PT is better from Germany or even America.

[matthewg]

Sydney's Alstom Citadis were built in Spain too - only the first 2 (or 4?) were built in France - I assume so that production engineering could create a set of build instructions for the Barcelona factory. (They were one of the first Citadis 05 series trams built)
I can only assume that boiler-makers and other allied metalworking trades are much cheaper in Spain than in France (or Germany), hence the French-designed trams being built in Spain.
CAF definitely has quality control issues in the welding department. Multiple orders and product lines have had problems that come back to welds.

[tonyp]

Sydney's Alstom Citadis were built in Spain too - only the first 2 (or 4?) were built in France - I assume so that production engineering could create a set of build instructions for the Barcelona factory. (They were one of the first Citadis 05 series trams built)
I can only assume that boiler-makers and other allied metalworking trades are much cheaper in Spain than in France (or Germany), hence the French-designed trams being built in Spain.
CAF definitely has quality control issues in the welding department. Multiple orders and product lines have had problems that come back to welds.

Yes, but that's different from a Spanish company building in Spain. Alstom would be enforcing their own quality metrics on the Spanish operation, similarly with other offshoring by major European manufacturers, like factories in China, Mexico, South Africa etc.

Still, it can be a struggle. I had a German friend who was a quality control engineer, working for Volkswagen group among others. The best quality VAG (VW) products came from Czech Republic and Slovakia, followed closely by Germany. They struggled with their Spanish company (SEAT) to bring the quality up to par, even to the standard of the China factories.

[Swift]

The Spanish speaking are definitely a different world.

[Fleet Lists]

https://transportnsw.info/news/2023/l1- ... aintenance

L1 Dulwich Hill Line weekend full closure due to maintenance
Monday 06 November 2023

From Saturday 18 to Sunday 19 November, daily from 6am to 11pm, L1 Dulwich Hill Line light rail services will not run due to planned trackwork and maintenance works.

During this time, use alternative transport including:

Replacement bus services between Central Grand Concourse and Dulwich Hill,
Train services and regular bus services, in areas where applicable.
If possible, walk is an alternative transport option for travel between Central Station, Darling Harbour, and Pyrmont due to increased road traffic.

Replacement bus services:

L1 replacement bus services will run daily from 6am to 11pm as follows:

From 6am to 7am: every 15 to 20 min,
From 7am to 7pm: every 10 to 15 min,
From 7pm to 11pm: every 15 to 20 min.

These times may vary depending on road traffic.

Please note:

Due to long-term roadworks and associated road redirections in the Arlington area for the Inner West Council’s GreenWay project, Dulwich Grove and Arlington replacement bus stops have changed locations until further notice. See L1 replacement bus stop locations.
Replacement buses will not stop at the following locations:
Capitol Square (towards Central and Dulwich Hill) - Please use the alternative stop at Central Grand Concourse or walk to Central Station (approx. 7 minute walk),
Exhibition Centre (towards Dulwich Hill) - Please use the alternative stop at Convention (approx. 7 minute walk),
Pyrmont Bay (towards Central and Dulwich Hill) - Please use the alternative stop at The Star (approx. 5 minute walk).

Most replacement buses will be accessible; if not, wait for the next service.

You must tap on and tap off when boarding and alighting replacement buses. Opal readers are located onboard all replacement buses. A standard light rail fare applies.

Normal L2 Randwick Line and L3 Kingsford Line light rail services will continue to run.
Allow extra travel time and use the Trip Planner or check travel alerts to see if your travel is affected.

Normal L1 light rail services between Central Grand Concourse and Dulwich Hill will resume from 6am Monday 20 November.

Walking distance in Sydney CBD, between Central Station, Darling Harbour and Pyrmont
Walking distance along the L1 Line
L1 replacement bus stop locations

Timetable is available for replacement route 1L1 operated bt Transdev John Holland.

[Linto63]

L1 Dulwich Hill Line weekend full closure due to maintenance

Probably more relevant to the Inner West Light Rail thread. The imminent opening of the new footbridge at Dulwich Hill won't require a light rail closure.

[Fleet Lists]

Oops Yes = Moved

[MiCCROwavE_OVEN]

It seems the four Urbos 100 trams have finally entered service - I didn't hear anything much about them until today. Media seems relatively reluctant to shine any attention on these brand new trams for the Inner West, which would supposedly increase service capacity (the current 13 minute headway is absolutely pathetic).

Unfortunately, they seem to have the same door layout as the older Urbos 3 trams and the square framed windows don't seem like a great design choice - just look at what happened with the de Havilland Comet back in the '50s. For a more relevant example, CDCNSW R4's Volvo B7RLE Volgren CR228Ls have square framed windows, and on almost all of the vehicles I've been on there have been cracks in the interior wall material. Hopefully history won't repeat itself with these new IWLR vehicles, or the Parramatta Light Rail sets...

[Merc1107]

Unfortunately, they seem to have the same door layout as the older Urbos 3 trams and the square framed windows don't seem like a great design choice - just look at what happened with the de Havilland Comet back in the '50s.

I didn't know the IWLR ascended to 40,000ft during its journey!

[tonyp]

CAFs crack anyway at ground level.

[MiCCROwavE_OVEN]

I didn't know the IWLR ascended to 40,000ft during its journey!

As I mentioned above, the same issue is evident in CDCNSW Region 4's Volgren CR228Ls, with cracked interior panels. The IWLR vehicles are arguably put under more stress than a 12.5m rigid bus, especially with those tight curves in the approach to Central and at Pyrmont.