25/10/2020 Bus service changes - Inner West

[swtt]

What happened to the concept of the inner west buses looping through the Rawson Place tram stop then heading out west again?

Works only if you can guarantee their inbound journey running on time

Maybe at a later stage of changes. This is only the start I suspect.

[boronia]

What happened to the concept of the inner west buses looping through the Rawson Place tram stop then heading out west again?

Works only if you can guarantee their inbound journey running on time

Maybe at a later stage of changes. This is only the start I suspect.

I think Rawson Place could only hold about 3 buses at a time. I've seen more than that at Railway Square at times. Ideally, you would want the "green line" services to use it too.
There is currently no right turn lane from Pitt St southbound into Rawson Place. The limitations of the stop could result in a long queue to get in.
Co-ordinating departures of too many buses with trams crossing their path will slow movements.

[grog]

The right lane of Pitt is a bus only right turn into Rawson Place. It is painted red.

[tonyp]

Why would you want buses to go into Rawson Place south-bound from Pitt St? The whole idea of that interchange is only for buses coming in from the south/west via Pitt St to rotate through the stop to feed and collect from the tram, then exit back west via George St.

I can see the potential constraints of that stop, but with our three-door, all door loading buses, each bus would only be dwelling at the stop for 15 seconds and then off again through the highly synchronised, quick-cycle lights ..... oh wait ..... um sorry, this is Sydney NSW, I forgot. Correction: each bus will be at the stop for one minute slowly loading and unloading mostly through one door, then will be waiting five minutes at the light for the tram to arrive from somewhere up near Hay St.

OK I get the message. So we have two useless and completely unused interchange stops at Rawson Place and Kingsford. Lucky that's the only thing bungled with this project.

[swtt]

Why would you want buses to go into Rawson Place south-bound from Pitt St? The whole idea of that interchange is only for buses coming in from the south/west via Pitt St to rotate through the stop to feed and collect from the tram, then exit back west via George St.

I can see the potential constraints of that stop, but with our three-door, all door loading buses, each bus would only be dwelling at the stop for 15 seconds and then off again through the highly synchronised, quick-cycle lights ..... oh wait ..... um sorry, this is Sydney NSW, I forgot. Correction: each bus will be at the stop for one minute slowly loading and unloading mostly through one door, then will be waiting five minutes at the light for the tram to arrive from somewhere up near Hay St.

OK I get the message. So we have two useless and completely unused interchange stops at Rawson Place and Kingsford. Lucky that's the only thing bungled with this project.

Maybe wait for the full CSELR bus network to kick in. This change on 25/10 I suspect is only the first of the many changes upcoming.

[J_Busworth]

It really is the second of what I expect will be many smaller adjustments to the network in relation to CSELR. We had a return to High Street in August, now cut of the M10 and M50 in October. I expect changes to keep happening in small lots each time there are wider network changes.

My understanding is that they would have liked to introduce all of these Inner West changes in line with a full new Eastern Suburbs network at the same time earlier this year, but the delay to the Eastern Changes has forced them to go alone.

[swtt]

It really is the second of what I expect will be many smaller adjustments to the network in relation to CSELR. We had a return to High Street in August, now cut of the M10 and M50 in October. I expect changes to keep happening in small lots each time there are wider network changes.

My understanding is that they would have liked to introduce all of these Inner West changes in line with a full new Eastern Suburbs network at the same time earlier this year, but the delay to the Eastern Changes has forced them to go alone.

If all of the changes were staggered in, it might not have to go through consultation as well So maybe expect smaller batches of route changes each and every time.

[tonyp]

https://www.news.com.au/finance/busines ... 17825e20c3

[swtt]

Did anyone see the link to this new network map when the news first broke of the route changes?

https://static1.squarespace.com/static/ ... 201025.pdf

Also I'm a bit surprised they didn't take the opportunity to rename 420 to 420X, given along the entire route it isn't all stops. Having said that, 410 would probably also would qualify if it were to become a truly rapid route with more stops removed (average 800 m between stops).

[stupid_girl]

It seems only 438X/N and 461X/N will join 440 to use Haymarket light rail stop.

The largest loser in the new network is perhaps Bayview Park. It will lose direct access to both city and Ashfield.

[boronia]

Did anyone see the link to this new network map when the news first broke of the route changes?

https://static1.squarespace.com/static/ ... 201025.pdf

Also I'm a bit surprised they didn't take the opportunity to rename 420 to 420X, given along the entire route it isn't all stops. Having said that, 410 would probably also would qualify if it were to become a truly rapid route with more stops removed (average 800 m between stops).

Most of the X and N routes are variations of a "master" route.

The 400 and 420 are hybrids in that they are not L or X versions of another route. They stop at all the designated stops for those routes but skip other stops allocated only to other routes.

[Cazza]

The largest loser in the new network is perhaps Bayview Park. It will lose direct access to both city and Ashfield.

Much quicker to get the bus to Burwood and change for a train to Ashfield than travel via the old 466 route through Strathfield, Croydon Park etc. Ditto for the CBD via route 502.

[swtt]

Most of the X and N routes are variations of a "master" route.

The 400 and 420 are hybrids in that they are not L or X versions of another route. They stop at all the designated stops for those routes but skip other stops allocated only to other routes.

But with the master routes no longer applicable, perhaps it's time to make things actually consistent?

[Stu]

The largest loser in the new network is perhaps Bayview Park. It will lose direct access to both city and Ashfield.

Much quicker to get the bus to Burwood and change for a train to Ashfield than travel via the old 466 route through Strathfield, Croydon Park etc. Ditto for the CBD via route 502.

The 466 hasn't operated via Strathfield since May 2018, the service reverted back to its original route - the modified route via Strathfield occurred in March 2010. There is one morning service on school days that diverts to Santa Sabina College at Strathfield.

[Cazza]

Yes, granted, it doesn't run via Strathfield Station/Strathfield proper. I was more referring to the dogleg it takes around Strathfield South and Enfield. But my point still stands.

[swtt]

Yes, granted, it doesn't run via Strathfield Station/Strathfield proper. I was more referring to the dogleg it takes around Strathfield South and Enfield. But my point still stands.

Mind you, still along old tram line alignments!

[Qantas94Heavy]

Did anyone see the link to this new network map when the news first broke of the route changes?

That definitely wasn't there when it was originally released

There are a few smaller changes that seem to show up on the new map. 305 goes past Mascot station instead of detouring via Kent Rd, and 308 looks like it'll use the new bus stops on Edinburgh Rd once they've done with the roadworks in the area.

Also on demand area in the new map now includes the area previously covered by the 439 bus.

[thunderbird]

I love how 370 is missing altogether.

[J_Busworth]

I love how 370 is missing altogether.

370 is counted as STA Region 9, so not on the Transit System network map

[marcnut1996]

I just noticed that in the network map, 503 will travel along Bathurst St citybound.

[iamthouth]

Did anyone see the link to this new network map when the news first broke of the route changes?

https://static1.squarespace.com/static/ ... 201025.pdf

It's a shame the Green Lines aren't coloured green.

[Stu]

Did anyone see the link to this new network map when the news first broke of the route changes?

That definitely wasn't there when it was originally released

There are a few smaller changes that seem to show up on the new map. 305 goes past Mascot station instead of detouring via Kent Rd, and 308 looks like it'll use the new bus stops on Edinburgh Rd once they've done with the roadworks in the area.

Also on demand area in the new map now includes the area previously covered by the 439 bus.

The on demand service has always operated in the Concord and Mortlake areas, the only exception is services cannot enter the Breakfast Point estate.

[J_Busworth]

I just noticed that in the network map, 503 will travel along Bathurst St citybound.

Is it being operated as a loop service? In via Bathurst and out via Druitt?

[Qantas94Heavy]

The on demand service has always operated in the Concord and Mortlake areas, the only exception is services cannot enter the Breakfast Point estate.

Sorry should have been more specific, was referring to the Gipps St/Bayview Rd part of the route.

[marcnut1996]

I just noticed that in the network map, 503 will travel along Bathurst St citybound.

Is it being operated as a loop service? In via Bathurst and out via Druitt?

I honestly can't tell from the network map. When the timetables are released, we will know.