Sydney Bus changes 28th July 2019

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boronia
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Re: 30/6 and 1/7/2019 Transport alterations

Post by boronia »

Better to improve the frequency with standard buses.
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Daniel
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Re: 30/6 and 1/7/2019 Transport alterations

Post by Daniel »

swtt wrote:
Stu wrote:High capacity buses are needed on routes 400 & 420, TfNSW had to revise the original 420 timetable in December 2018 due to capacity issues. There will most likely be a timetable update again at the end of this month in conjunction with the 14.5 units have been retired, some short working services to meet expected capacity.
Very surprised that there have been no artics ordered to replace the 14.5s.
I’m not surprised - artics have much higher acquisition, maintenance and running costs compared to a rigid.
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Re: 30/6 and 1/7/2019 Transport alterations

Post by swtt »

Stu wrote:High capacity buses are needed on routes 400 & 420, TfNSW had to revise the original 420 timetable in December 2018 due to capacity issues. There will most likely be a timetable update again at the end of this month in conjunction with the 14.5 units have been retired, some short working services to meet expected capacity.
Where will these shortworking be between? Burwood & Campsie or Burwood & Rockdale?
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Re: 30/6 and 1/7/2019 Transport alterations

Post by tonyp »

Daniel wrote: I’m not surprised - artics have much higher acquisition, maintenance and running costs compared to a rigid.
... and higher productivity, plus often a smaller requirement for rigid buses and drivers as numbers add up.
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Re: 30/6 and 1/7/2019 Transport alterations

Post by Linto63 »

Some artics will be freed up when the light rail opens, this will provide extra capacity, although IIRC they can't work the 400 or 420 because of clearance issues at Westfield Eastgardens. Gladys stated in 2017 that the government planned to "phase out bendy-buses that cause increased congestion on our streets", so not surprising no more have been ordered.
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Re: 30/6 and 1/7/2019 Transport alterations

Post by tonyp »

Linto63 wrote:Some artics will be freed up when the light rail opens, this will provide extra capacity, although IIRC they can't work the 400 or 420 because of clearance issues at Westfield Eastgardens. Gladys stated in 2017 that the government planned to "phase out bendy-buses that cause increased congestion on our streets", so not surprising no more have been ordered.
I read it as no more than the usual internal up and down "warring camps" factor within the transport agency and what was said in 2017 may not be what is thought in the future. A good test will be to see how they plan to run the 333 when the artics reach the end of their service life because there won't be anything else that does the job as well other than trams. Perhaps they think that they will be able to build light rail to Bondi Beach by then.
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Re: 30/6 and 1/7/2019 Transport alterations

Post by Linto63 »

It is what the incumbent premier and transport minister stated, and to date there has been in evidence of a change in policy. That said, apart from those on the B-Line, only a handful of deckers have been purchased in the years since that statement. The current artics will be around for another 15 years, as to what will replace them, nobody knows.
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Re: 30/6 and 1/7/2019 Transport alterations

Post by swtt »

Linto63 wrote:It is what the incumbent premier and transport minister stated, and to date there has been in evidence of a change in policy. That said, apart from those on the B-Line, only a handful of deckers have been purchased in the years since that statement. The current artics will be around for another 15 years, as to what will replace them, nobody knows.
I guess we'll see what happens when the Parramatta Road Homebush - City and Dee Why - Chatswood "B-line-like" service launches!
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Re: 30/6 and 1/7/2019 Transport alterations

Post by Fleet Lists »

Are they still alive? Any link to the Homebush one went dead months ago and for something that was supposed to happen by the end of 2019, I dont give it much hope. And I have nothing on the other one.
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Re: 30/6 and 1/7/2019 Transport alterations

Post by gld59 »

swtt wrote:Is there really no willpower to replace the 14.5s with say, artics?

(The other question is, are artics needed on route 420/400?)
Yes, they're needed. No, they *can't* operate that corridor, unless the route is altered at Eastgardens.
Linto63 wrote:The current artics will be around for another 15 years
(Roughly. Those operated by STA and Transit Systems were built from 06 to 11. )
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Re: 30/6 and 1/7/2019 Transport alterations

Post by tonyp »

Aren't buses supposed to be disposed of after about 12 years?!
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Re: 30/6 and 1/7/2019 Transport alterations

Post by rogf24 »

Not in NSW, keep em going for 25 years.
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Re: 30/6 and 1/7/2019 Transport alterations

Post by iamthouth »

It is only average fleet age that needs to be 12 years, max is 25 years and 364 days.
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Re: 30/6 and 1/7/2019 Transport alterations

Post by BroadGauge »

tonyp wrote:Aren't buses supposed to be disposed of after about 12 years?!
Don't go to either Tasmania or the ACT then - those jurisdictions are still running buses dating from 1990/1991 on (week)daily route service!
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Re: 30/6 and 1/7/2019 Transport alterations

Post by swtt »

BroadGauge wrote:
tonyp wrote:Aren't buses supposed to be disposed of after about 12 years?!
Don't go to either Tasmania or the ACT then - those jurisdictions are still running buses dating from 1990/1991 on (week)daily route service!
Gosh, the ACT light rail must really be revolutionary then!
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Re: 30/6 and 1/7/2019 Transport alterations

Post by 1whoknows »

Maximum and average age requirements vary from state to state. Lots of 70s and 80s buses still getting around on charters in Perth.

The main concern for urban buses is DDA compliance which Tasmania will meet by the end of 2020 when the current order for 100 Bustech XDIs is complete. Canberra is supposed to start getting new buses again later in the year with 70 something required to eliminate the rest of the high floor Renaults by 2020. DDA is of course another reason why the current 14.5s in Sydney have to go.
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Re: New bus network arising from SMNW opening

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The new timetables which were promised for Saturday 13th July are already up on Transport Info. Eg for 607X https://transportnsw.info/routes/detail ... 7x/23607-X
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Re: New bus network arising from SMNW opening

Post by Fleet Lists »

And while on new timetables for 28th July, the region 6 timetables for the school term which were put up this morning only last for a week so it appears as though they will also have further new timetables for 28/7.
And while on the school term timetables, the ones for region 6 have a problem in that Sunday timetables are missing with what appear to be Sunday trips showing as Monday trips. Some Transdev new school term timetables only show Tuesday to Friday trips.
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Re: New bus network arising from SMNW opening

Post by swtt »

Fleet Lists wrote:And while on new timetables for 28th July, the region 6 timetables for the school term which were put up this morning only last for a week so it appears as though they will also have further new timetables for 28/7.
And while on the school term timetables, the ones for region 6 have a problem in that Sunday timetables are missing with what appear to be Sunday trips showing as Monday trips. Some Transdev new school term timetables only show Tuesday to Friday trips.
Maybe what Stu mentioned about 420 getting extra short runners would also start on 28/7?

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Re: New bus network arising from SMNW opening

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STA East and North West timetables also cease on 27/7 so expect new timetables there as well on 28/7
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Re: New bus network arising from SMNW opening

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Fleet Lists wrote:The new timetables which were promised for Saturday 13th July are already up on Transport Info. Eg for 607X https://transportnsw.info/routes/detail ... 7x/23607-X
They seem to have disappeared now.
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Sydney Bus changes on 28th July

Post by Fleet Lists »

Have just been advised that they were removed because of the other problems they ran into today. It is hoped to have the Transdev timetables fixed by tomorrow and the Transit Systems timetables by Friday when they also hope to have the new Hillsbus timetables available again.
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Re: 30/6 and 1/7/2019 Transport alterations

Post by Frosty »

More evidence TSA Burwood is soon to operate the 420 saw B depot bus on a route training run along Botany Rd heading towards the Airport with a bunch of drivers onboard.
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Re: 30/6 and 1/7/2019 Transport alterations

Post by burrumbus »

1whoknows wrote:Maximum and average age requirements vary from state to state. Lots of 70s and 80s buses still getting around on charters in Perth.

The main concern for urban buses is DDA compliance which Tasmania will meet by the end of 2020 when the current order for 100 Bustech XDIs is complete. Canberra is supposed to start getting new buses again later in the year with 70 something required to eliminate the rest of the high floor Renaults by 2020. DDA is of course another reason why the current 14.5s in Sydney have to go.
Correct 1whoknows.
The major concern with the withdrawal of the 14.5 metre Scanias is the loss of lots of seating and standing capacity.
Even though artics are more expensive to operate and purchase than rigids the uplift in seating and standing capacity more than compensates for the extra rigid buses and drivers needed to move pax on those super busy routes that need capacity.
That is one of the major problems in Sydney with the one bus size fits all routes mentality.
The capacity on busy routes is not there to move the crowds.Under investment in high capacity buses really cruels the abilty to shift pax on the busy routes/corridors.
Paradoxically use of rigid buses on low patronage routes also has the same effect.
Until appropriate investment and sensible rostering practices are in place at STA mainly the capacity to shift the crowds(which are growing)on busy routes/corridors will not be there.
Silly really-but it has been going on for decades since the trams were replaced.
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Re: 30/6 and 1/7/2019 Transport alterations

Post by burrumbus »

Frosty wrote:More evidence TSA Burwood is soon to operate the 420 saw B depot bus on a route training run along Botany Rd heading towards the Airport with a bunch of drivers onboard.
That will be very interesting to see TSA operate that service.
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