Ferry Observations 2020

Sydney / New South Wales Transport Discussion
Post Reply
User avatar
Fleet Lists
Administrator
Posts: 21734
Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2004 12:49 pm
Location: The Shire

Ferry Observations 2020

Post by Fleet Lists »

Welcome to 2020.
Living in the Shire.
User avatar
Fleet Lists
Administrator
Posts: 21734
Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2004 12:49 pm
Location: The Shire

Re: Ferry Observations 2020

Post by Fleet Lists »

The first one for the year is quite an extensive one, covering proposed changes to the Sydney Ferries network for both 2020 and 2021.

See https://yoursay.transdev.com.au/

Even a new proposed F10.
Living in the Shire.
stupid_girl
Posts: 821
Joined: Fri Sep 04, 2009 3:25 pm

Re: Ferry Observations 2020

Post by stupid_girl »

The cross harbour route shouldn't have been merged in the first place because of different demand in the east and west. I'm glad to see the split.
User avatar
Fleet Lists
Administrator
Posts: 21734
Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2004 12:49 pm
Location: The Shire

Re: Ferry Observations 2020

Post by Fleet Lists »

Interesting for the Manly service
F1 Manly services improvements

The frequency of services between Circular Quay and Manly will be improved from every 30 minutes to every 20 minutes on weekdays, and every 10 minutes during the day on weekends. The improved frequency, especially on weekends when demand is at its highest, will give customers more choice in when they travel.

To enable this change we will introduce three brand new Emerald Class ferries. These vessels are fully accessible with capacity for around 400 customers. The new vessels have been designed to deliver a superior customer experience and will add to the iconic Sydney Ferries fleet a new modern look.

They will also complete the trip in around 22 minutes, almost 10 minutes faster than the current Manly ferry.

No decision has been made as yet on the future of the Freshwater fleet.
I can not see how three new vessels can operate every 10 minutes when it will still take 22 minutes each way ie at least 44 minutes around so at least 5 vessels would be required. I suppose they could supplement the three new ones with two existing Emerald class vessels.
Living in the Shire.
User avatar
boronia
Posts: 19752
Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2004 6:18 am
Favourite Vehicle: Fire engine; PD4107
Location: Sydney

Re: Ferry Observations 2020

Post by boronia »

By the time you add in the turn-around dwells, a round trip could be closer to 60 minute cycles.

Presumably the weekend trips would include some Freshwater services?
The Sydney Classic and Antique Truck (and Bus) Show
On again June 2021
@ The Museum of Fire.
stupid_girl
Posts: 821
Joined: Fri Sep 04, 2009 3:25 pm

Re: Ferry Observations 2020

Post by stupid_girl »

boronia wrote:By the time you add in the turn-around dwells, a round trip could be closer to 60 minute cycles.

Presumably the weekend trips would include some Freshwater services?
It would be difficult to roster both types of ferries because they share the same wharves but sail at different speeds.
User avatar
boronia
Posts: 19752
Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2004 6:18 am
Favourite Vehicle: Fire engine; PD4107
Location: Sydney

Re: Ferry Observations 2020

Post by boronia »

But the Emeralds would not need to use the double-deck wharves. The new t/t's suggest there would be a reduction in services going to CQ, perhaps freeing up space elsewhere?
The Sydney Classic and Antique Truck (and Bus) Show
On again June 2021
@ The Museum of Fire.
stupid_girl
Posts: 821
Joined: Fri Sep 04, 2009 3:25 pm

Re: Ferry Observations 2020

Post by stupid_girl »

boronia wrote:But the Emeralds would not need to use the double-deck wharves. The new t/t's suggest there would be a reduction in services going to CQ, perhaps freeing up space elsewhere?
If they roster both types of ferries using different wharves, then the tourists will likely be confused.
User avatar
boronia
Posts: 19752
Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2004 6:18 am
Favourite Vehicle: Fire engine; PD4107
Location: Sydney

Re: Ferry Observations 2020

Post by boronia »

Using both sides of the same pontoon shouldn't confuse people. But a lot of tourists can't cope when they have only one choice.
The Sydney Classic and Antique Truck (and Bus) Show
On again June 2021
@ The Museum of Fire.
User avatar
Newcastle Flyer
Posts: 4501
Joined: Fri Apr 09, 2004 1:20 pm
Location: Somewhere between here, there & anywhere!

Re: Ferry Observations 2020

Post by Newcastle Flyer »

^ At Fleet Lists, you're telling who to provide links again?
White lives matter too.
Australia Day 26th Jan, one of the most important days in Australia
User avatar
jpp42
Posts: 1182
Joined: Sat Jul 09, 2011 8:27 pm

Re: Ferry Observations 2020

Post by jpp42 »

stupid_girl wrote:The cross harbour route shouldn't have been merged in the first place because of different demand in the east and west. I'm glad to see the split.
Rose Bay demand is fairly high and I guess that's what they thought matched? And Watsons Bay on weekends. Since Watsons Bay is a tourist destination it makes some sense to combine them as tourists only have to worry about this service and Manly to cover most of where they need to go. Certainly, Watsons Bay to Darling Harbour is an important tourist route that the current arrangement serves well.
ftr10
Posts: 34
Joined: Sat Mar 20, 2004 1:13 pm

Re: Ferry Observations 2020

Post by ftr10 »

Judging by the feedback so far, the biggest complaints are the forced interchange of passengers at Balmain East or Barangaroo going to McMahons Point, Milsons Point or Circular Quay from the F3 and F8 services, and quite rightly so. The walk from Barangaroo to Wynyard is a tad too far, and Balmain East will be inundated with people interchanging between ferries especially during peak hours.
User avatar
boronia
Posts: 19752
Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2004 6:18 am
Favourite Vehicle: Fire engine; PD4107
Location: Sydney

Re: Ferry Observations 2020

Post by boronia »

The Sydney Classic and Antique Truck (and Bus) Show
On again June 2021
@ The Museum of Fire.
arrowflight
Posts: 5
Joined: Sun Feb 09, 2020 5:11 pm

Re: Ferry Observations 2020

Post by arrowflight »

ftr10 wrote:...The walk from Barangaroo to Wynyard is a tad too far, ...
Barangaroo Wharf to Wynyard looks to be about 550 metre walk. The cynic in me thought "Aha, what about the proposed Metro station! Funnel the SLF in that direction!". The only information I seem to be able to find is 'Hickson Street, just south of Minn Street." From Google maps and a walk through there last year, probably just around - or just south of - the artificial cove at Barangaroo. If so, this would be a 700 metre walk from the wharf. Neither option is particularly suitable. Roughly one-third of each walk has no cover from the elements.
ftr10 wrote:... and Balmain East will be inundated with people interchanging between ferries especially during peak hours.
Someone elsewhere noted that the "new' Balmain East Wharf is able to dock two ferries... one on each side of the pontoon. However, the pontoon itself is not particularly large. I would not like to be on the pontoon for a peak hour interchange.

--------------------
* Self Loading Freight
User avatar
marcnut1996
Posts: 514
Joined: Tue Feb 18, 2014 10:21 pm
Favourite Vehicle: Custom Endeavour
Location: Sydney Regions 1 & 6, formerly at Regions 7 & 9
Contact:

Re: Ferry Observations 2020

Post by marcnut1996 »

There is also this url which contains some details about the network redesign. https://yoursay.transdev.com.au/
Lives in Region 1, loves buses in Western Sydney.
User avatar
boronia
Posts: 19752
Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2004 6:18 am
Favourite Vehicle: Fire engine; PD4107
Location: Sydney

Re: Ferry Observations 2020

Post by boronia »

From MFF facebook page:
NRMA Members now save up to 25% on selected My Fast Ferry services to Manly. And, if you’re over 60, you can travel for $2.80 during off-peak and weekend services.

Simply link your Opal card via the my nrma app, then tap and save – every trip.
and
https://www.mynrma.com.au/membership/be ... Zj8se4jZDk
The Sydney Classic and Antique Truck (and Bus) Show
On again June 2021
@ The Museum of Fire.
User avatar
Fleet Lists
Administrator
Posts: 21734
Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2004 12:49 pm
Location: The Shire

Re: Ferry Observations 2020

Post by Fleet Lists »

Came across a replacement route 60F3 to be operated by Hillsbus to replace the Parramatta ferry between Rydalmere and Parramatta from 7th April 2020.

Also alert:
From 7 April until September 2020, F3 Parramatta River ferries will not stop at Parramatta Wharf, while construction works for the Escarpment Boardwalk take place. Route 60F3 temporary bus services will replace ferries between Parramatta and Rydalmere.
Living in the Shire.
User avatar
Fleet Lists
Administrator
Posts: 21734
Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2004 12:49 pm
Location: The Shire

Re: Ferry Observations 2020

Post by Fleet Lists »

New Manly Fast ferry timetable on Transport Info dated 4 April 2020. No idea what differences.
Living in the Shire.
User avatar
tonyp
Posts: 9834
Joined: Tue Nov 28, 2006 2:31 am
Location: Shoalhaven

Re: Ferry Observations 2020

Post by tonyp »

Perpetually on a T3 to "I. P. Pavlova, přestup na Metro. Příští zastávka, Náměsti Míru"
User avatar
tonyp
Posts: 9834
Joined: Tue Nov 28, 2006 2:31 am
Location: Shoalhaven

Re: Ferry Observations 2020

Post by tonyp »

... and the beginnings of revival:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MBYeCMhLZz8
Perpetually on a T3 to "I. P. Pavlova, přestup na Metro. Příští zastávka, Náměsti Míru"
User avatar
tonyp
Posts: 9834
Joined: Tue Nov 28, 2006 2:31 am
Location: Shoalhaven

Re: Ferry Observations 2020

Post by tonyp »

In all of the angst about ferry privatisation in the last decade, most people seemed to overlook the fact that, apart from the vehicular ferries at Ryde, Mortlake, The Spit and Hawkesbury and Georges Rivers, Sydney's ferries were government-operated for less than 40 of their 189 years of service. This film is from the late 1960s, in the last years of the first long period of private operation, when, since 1951 almost all Sydney ferry services were operated by the Port Jackson and Manly Steamship Co., a company with origins dating back to 1877 and many of whose shareholders were Manly-Warringah residents. The Port Jackson Co. also operated Pittwater and Hawkesbury ferries. A few services using smaller boats were operated by the private firms of Rosman, Nicholson and Stannards. Rosman's "Radar" can be glimpsed in this film. Some beautiful shots of "South Steyne" (both ferry and beach!) and a bonus Tin Hare at the end.

Posted in the interests of livening enforced home confinements!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e6NdSp6h_sY
Perpetually on a T3 to "I. P. Pavlova, přestup na Metro. Příští zastávka, Náměsti Míru"
moa999
Posts: 2599
Joined: Fri Nov 23, 2012 3:12 pm

Re: Ferry Observations 2020

Post by moa999 »

I still find it strange that ferries are the only mode where you have timetabled route services (distinguishing from premium tourist services) operating outside of the Opal system.

You've got the Manly Fast Ferry and then Captain Cook's Lane Cove and Manly-Barangaroo ferry afaik.
Linto63
Posts: 1287
Joined: Wed Feb 03, 2016 3:44 pm

Re: Ferry Observations 2020

Post by Linto63 »

moa999 wrote:I still find it strange that ferries are the only mode where you have timetabled route services (distinguishing from premium tourist services) operating outside of the Opal system..
These are premium services that duplicate services are part of the Opal network. Introduce Opal and the call will go out for the fares to be the same, which would mean the government would be subsidising services that currently pay their own way.
User avatar
Fleet Lists
Administrator
Posts: 21734
Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2004 12:49 pm
Location: The Shire

Re: Ferry Observations 2020

Post by Fleet Lists »

Opal is available on these services as OpalPay where different fares are paid.
Living in the Shire.
moa999
Posts: 2599
Joined: Fri Nov 23, 2012 3:12 pm

Re: Ferry Observations 2020

Post by moa999 »

Linto63 wrote: These are premium services that duplicate services are part of the Opal network. Introduce Opal and the call will go out for the fares to be the same, which would mean the government would be subsidising services that currently pay their own way.
FastFerry yes.. and could have say another $1/2 surcharge.
The other two are more what I could call route services, although there are some bus routes that go close to the Lane Cove ferry stops


More amazing that CC can seemingly operate these services at a profit charging roughly the same fares as normal ferry services (admittedly focusing on peak hours only), whereas there is a massive farebox subsidy for the Sydney Ferries routes.
Post Reply

Return to “Discussion - Sydney / NSW”