Parramatta light rail

Sydney / New South Wales Transport Discussion
STMPainter2018
Posts: 268
Joined: Sun Aug 19, 2018 6:38 pm

Re: Parramatta light rail

Post by STMPainter2018 »

User avatar
tonyp
Posts: 9842
Joined: Tue Nov 28, 2006 2:31 am
Location: Shoalhaven

Re: Parramatta light rail

Post by tonyp »

Don't worry, it's just another Constance thought bubble. This one still has a long way to play out.
Perpetually on a T3 to "I. P. Pavlova, přestup na Metro. Příští zastávka, Náměsti Míru"
User avatar
eddy
Posts: 2631
Joined: Mon Mar 03, 2008 11:18 am
Contact:

Re: Parramatta light rail

Post by eddy »

Andrew said he would be a mug not to check out other options like my Trailerbus
Parrahub, an extra option in the public transport menu https://3dwarehouse.sketchup.com/model/ ... rahub-2016
User avatar
Swift
Posts: 11180
Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2004 1:23 pm
Favourite Vehicle: Porshe 911 Carerra
Location: Ettalong- the world capital of 0405s.

Re: Parramatta light rail

Post by Swift »

After the sheer heartache for little result represented by that other lr project, he has my support.

The stage one is just an elaborate way to shut down the Carlo line. What an exercise in lazy cheap planning.
Global w̶a̶r̶m̶i̶n̶g̶ hoax.
With the left in charge the future is doomed.
So sick of transit hobbyist's superior attitudes.
NSW will never reach the level of greatness under Wran ever again.
User avatar
captainch
Posts: 4566
Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2004 2:37 am
Favourite Vehicle: was 3533 m/o 687
Location: INGHAM NTH QLD.

Re: Parramatta light rail

Post by captainch »

NOT Only is stage 2 of the PARRAMATTA LIGHT RAIL CANNED Also announced tonights news the 7 new river cat ferrys have over 100 DEFECTS SINCE THEY ARRIVED WITH THE 2ND ORDER CANCELLED. never happened when we built our trains in newcastle also our ferrys which have lasted nearlly 50 years again built in newcastle but GLADY'S SHREDDER states we can't built them yet melb built their trams & trains in victoria Brisbanes going back to building trains in qld. its not that hard! The new rivercats might only go as far as meadowbank passengers will be given a canoe to go the rest of the way to parramatta.
"CAPTAIN.C.H Still lives" :twisted: :shock: "JUST"
Linto63
Posts: 1295
Joined: Wed Feb 03, 2016 3:44 pm

Re: Parramatta light rail

Post by Linto63 »

Been a few reports in recent weeks about stage 2 being cancelled, would appear to be a bit of softening up by the government so that when confirmation comes, nobody is overly surprised.
Geo101
Posts: 136
Joined: Mon Aug 11, 2014 10:55 am

Re: Parramatta light rail

Post by Geo101 »

Linto63 wrote: Thu Nov 12, 2020 6:25 pm Been a few reports in recent weeks about stage 2 being cancelled, would appear to be a bit of softening up by the government so that when confirmation comes, nobody is overly surprised.
I'm no expert, but that stretch running down South Street in Rydalmere doesn't really add up? It's basically a light industrial area, not much traffic outside of the Monday-Friday morning and afternoon peak hour. Check out the 524-bus timetable and statistics if one needs any evidence.

Where do most residents in Rhodes and Meadowbank want to travel to, probably a large proportion want to go to Sydney CBD, not Parramatta CBD.

I can see the figures for the old Carlingford line spur, a cheap(ish) conversion as per the Inner West LR, but not the bit down South Street, connecting Rhodes and Meadowbank to Parramatta.

Unless they project a massive number of residents in Camillia, I can also see the business case for a metro station there not adding up as well, which is pretty much already a foregone conclusion. IF, Camelia becomes skyscraper city, some regular bus routes to the Camillia LR stop will suffice, it would be very unlikely that the trams will be overflowing?

The only way the business case would stack up, is if they converted the Olympic Park Spur to light rail after the metro is finished IMO.

And I doubt very much that is going to happen...
User avatar
Campbelltown busboy
Posts: 1295
Joined: Sun Aug 11, 2013 1:23 pm
Location: Ruse/Campbelltown City NSW

Re: Parramatta light rail

Post by Campbelltown busboy »

This light rail line sounds like it will take less time to build then the CBD light rail line witch took about 5 years to build witch in that timeline we had 3 premiers (if construction started before Barry got done over that bottle of grange) and 2 transport ministers
User avatar
jpp42
Posts: 1186
Joined: Sat Jul 09, 2011 8:27 pm

Re: Parramatta light rail

Post by jpp42 »

Few articles today about government paying way over fair value for a parcel in Camellia:
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-11-16/ ... l/12881058

Am I correct in understanding that if Stage 2 is cancelled, as rumoured, this parcel won't be needed at all?
User avatar
tonyp
Posts: 9842
Joined: Tue Nov 28, 2006 2:31 am
Location: Shoalhaven

Re: Parramatta light rail

Post by tonyp »

jpp42 wrote: Mon Nov 16, 2020 12:29 pm Few articles today about government paying way over fair value for a parcel in Camellia:
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-11-16/ ... l/12881058

Am I correct in understanding that if Stage 2 is cancelled, as rumoured, this parcel won't be needed at all?
It's the depot site, so it's still needed.
Perpetually on a T3 to "I. P. Pavlova, přestup na Metro. Příští zastávka, Náměsti Míru"
User avatar
boronia
Posts: 19756
Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2004 6:18 am
Favourite Vehicle: Fire engine; PD4107
Location: Sydney

Re: Parramatta light rail

Post by boronia »

Campbelltown busboy wrote: Thu Nov 12, 2020 8:35 pm This light rail line sounds like it will take less time to build then the CBD light rail line witch took about 5 years to build witch in that timeline we had 3 premiers (if construction started before Barry got done over that bottle of grange) and 2 transport ministers
Probably won't be as many underground infrastructure problems as the Sydney CBD; and hopefully they will use open ballast on the railway line alignments.
The Sydney Classic and Antique Truck (and Bus) Show
On again June 2021
@ The Museum of Fire.
STMPainter2018
Posts: 268
Joined: Sun Aug 19, 2018 6:38 pm

Re: Parramatta light rail

Post by STMPainter2018 »

boronia wrote: Mon Nov 16, 2020 1:22 pm hopefully they will use open ballast on the railway line alignments.
Ahem... https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=2724464444439371 https://www.facebook.com/ParramattaLigh ... 5052639956 https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=222486532537704
User avatar
marcnut1996
Posts: 518
Joined: Tue Feb 18, 2014 10:21 pm
Favourite Vehicle: Custom Endeavour
Location: Sydney Regions 1 & 6, formerly at Regions 7 & 9
Contact:

Re: Parramatta light rail

Post by marcnut1996 »

Seems that PLR light rail stop names will be up for public comment from tomorrow (11 Dec) until 18 Jan 2021.
https://proposals.gnb.nsw.gov.au/currentproposals
Lives in Region 1, loves buses in Western Sydney.
User avatar
tonyp
Posts: 9842
Joined: Tue Nov 28, 2006 2:31 am
Location: Shoalhaven

Re: Parramatta light rail

Post by tonyp »

marcnut1996 wrote: Thu Dec 10, 2020 10:23 am Seems that PLR light rail stop names will be up for public comment from tomorrow (11 Dec) until 18 Jan 2021.
https://proposals.gnb.nsw.gov.au/currentproposals
If most of those names are meaningless to me after having lived in Sydney a lifetime, imagine what they must mean to visitors. Maybe time to reintroduce stop numbers.
Perpetually on a T3 to "I. P. Pavlova, přestup na Metro. Příští zastávka, Náměsti Míru"
Linto63
Posts: 1295
Joined: Wed Feb 03, 2016 3:44 pm

Re: Parramatta light rail

Post by Linto63 »

Like most tram stop names, some will be of little relevance other than those living in the immediate area, but what is the alternative when there are multiple stops in the one suburb? Only alternatives are numbers or using the nearest cross street.
User avatar
boronia
Posts: 19756
Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2004 6:18 am
Favourite Vehicle: Fire engine; PD4107
Location: Sydney

Re: Parramatta light rail

Post by boronia »

The Sydney Classic and Antique Truck (and Bus) Show
On again June 2021
@ The Museum of Fire.
User avatar
rogf24
Posts: 1148
Joined: Thu May 09, 2013 4:20 pm

Re: Parramatta light rail

Post by rogf24 »

If this means Stage 2 is delayed rather than cancelled, it shouldn't be too bad since Metro West if a while away as well. The light rail won't really be useful until then, especially as a feeder.
Transtopic
Posts: 1053
Joined: Fri Nov 25, 2011 10:10 pm

Re: Parramatta light rail

Post by Transtopic »

rogf24 wrote: Wed Dec 23, 2020 7:57 pm If this means Stage 2 is delayed rather than cancelled, it shouldn't be too bad since Metro West if a while away as well. The light rail won't really be useful until then, especially as a feeder.
It would be quicker to go by bus from Melrose Park to West Ryde Station along Victoria Rd, which is only 2km away, rather than all the way to Olympic Park metro station or even Rhodes for that matter. I'm not sure if a bridge over the Parramatta River is even needed, except as a new north/south road link, which would create its own problems.
grog
Posts: 553
Joined: Wed Nov 07, 2007 8:09 am
Location: Sydney

Re: Parramatta light rail

Post by grog »

Olympic Park to CBD travel time would be 14 minutes, and Olympic Park to Parramatta travel time would be 6 minutes. I’m sure this would outweigh any additional travel time vs West Ryde.
User avatar
boronia
Posts: 19756
Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2004 6:18 am
Favourite Vehicle: Fire engine; PD4107
Location: Sydney

Re: Parramatta light rail

Post by boronia »

The bridge from Wentworth Point to Rhodes had a very long gestation period. Six years seems about normal for something like this.
The Sydney Classic and Antique Truck (and Bus) Show
On again June 2021
@ The Museum of Fire.
Transtopic
Posts: 1053
Joined: Fri Nov 25, 2011 10:10 pm

Re: Parramatta light rail

Post by Transtopic »

grog wrote: Wed Dec 23, 2020 10:08 pm Olympic Park to CBD travel time would be 14 minutes, and Olympic Park to Parramatta travel time would be 6 minutes. I’m sure this would outweigh any additional travel time vs West Ryde.
You would say that wouldn't you. Of course you overlook the cost/benefit of spending a billion dollars or more on a questionable project like PLR Stage 2 instead of utilising existing infrastructure at minimal cost. I'm not surprised that the government has gone cold on Stage 2, considering that they're reluctant to release the business case. Wentworth Point already has a direct public transport link with Rhodes Station via Bennelong Bridge and it could also be adequately serviced by frequent bus services to Olympic Park metro station. Light Rail to perform this task is pure overkill. The proposed Stage 2 project was flawed from the start.
User avatar
Swift
Posts: 11180
Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2004 1:23 pm
Favourite Vehicle: Porshe 911 Carerra
Location: Ettalong- the world capital of 0405s.

Re: Parramatta light rail

Post by Swift »

I think the plain expense and ripoff of the Randwick and Kingsford lines has made light rail very unattractive as a choice and buses looking better than in the 50s!
They now have to have a very good case to go down that route.
Global w̶a̶r̶m̶i̶n̶g̶ hoax.
With the left in charge the future is doomed.
So sick of transit hobbyist's superior attitudes.
NSW will never reach the level of greatness under Wran ever again.
Transtopic
Posts: 1053
Joined: Fri Nov 25, 2011 10:10 pm

Re: Parramatta light rail

Post by Transtopic »

From the very beginning, the Parramatta Light Rail project should have adopted the preferred route in the independent feasibility study undertaken on behalf of Parramatta City Council, which was from Westmead to Macquarie Park via Parramatta and Eastwood. A light rail branch from Dundas along the Carlingford Line corridor to Carlingford could still have been included, but any further extension to Epping was never going to be viable, because of cost and construction constraints, which were belatedly acknowledged by Constance himself. But of course Transport for NSW in their wisdom chose to completely ignore it. It amazingly didn't even make their shortlist of options.

Parramatta and Macquarie Park are after all the largest strategic centres outside of the Sydney CBD and it beggars belief that a direct connection between them is still not on the agenda.

The overriding consideration appears to be to make use of the Carlingford Line infrastructure, regardless of its merits, compared with the more direct route via Eastwood. Labor made the same mistake when considering options for the Parramatta to Chatswood Rail Link. I hope they don't make the same mistake when considering a future metro link between Parramatta and Macquarie Park. I'll be pushing up daisies by then anyway.
User avatar
tonyp
Posts: 9842
Joined: Tue Nov 28, 2006 2:31 am
Location: Shoalhaven

Re: Parramatta light rail

Post by tonyp »

Swift wrote: Wed Dec 23, 2020 11:44 pm I think the plain expense and ripoff of the Randwick and Kingsford lines has made light rail very unattractive as a choice and buses looking better than in the 50s!
They now have to have a very good case to go down that route.
To the contrary, their inexplicable decision to scale back the capacity of the bus fleet by eliminating artics from the mix has made trams even more attractive than before and, if they can't build enough light rail, then even more metro - the densest possible system. The bus operation without artics doesn't have anything remotely like the capacity for heavy lifting. Just look at the miniscule capacity of the B Line, about 1,500 persons per hour per direction. Only feasible because just about everyone on the northern beaches drives.

There has to be some serious heavy-lifting modes layered on top of the bus system. The important thing is applying the appropriate mode to the appropriate need, whether that need is existing or in the form of a planning objective that densifies activity. The eastern branch of the PRL was tied in with major redevelopment of the north side of the river, on top of what has already occurred at Wentworth Point. The only thing I don't like is branching of either light rail or metro lines. Every branching slashes the potential capacity of the branches.That's one of the reasons that CSELR couldn't do the job of servicing increasing densification of the SE section of Anzac Pde. Every second tram goes off to Randwick.
Perpetually on a T3 to "I. P. Pavlova, přestup na Metro. Příští zastávka, Náměsti Míru"
Post Reply

Return to “Discussion - Sydney / NSW”