Only 8 Years ,Have we changed for the better?

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Only 8 Years ,Have we changed for the better?

Postby High Floor Bus » Sun Jan 22, 2012 2:41 am

Only 8 Years in since this series of photos were taken of Wellinton & Willam st precint in Perth. As a regular driver in this area and by the looks of the photos , i gots to ask the Q ,"Have we changed for the better?"

All shots date back to around 05/2004 before the Mandurah line tunnel works.
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Wellington & William st Pre Tunnel works 03-05-2004
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Now i'd would'nt guessed that only 4 years later after i took this shot that i be driving the pictured bus on a regular basis. :roll:
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William & roe st with 4 lanes
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Just look how wide it is,not a trafic jam in sight :D
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Looking south down William st
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A simple rail yard before the Tunnel came.
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Pre tunnel Perth rail yards
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Wellington st with 3 lanes and a car park & no underground entrance.
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Wellington st
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Hay st & William st one week before demo works started.
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Hay st & William st
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Esplanade & William st freeway entries before the Esplanade train station was built.
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Esplanade & William st
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Enjoy :D
Last edited by High Floor Bus on Sun Jan 22, 2012 11:55 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Only 8 Years ,Have we changed for the better?

Postby 1115 » Sun Jan 22, 2012 7:12 am

Thumbs up to the WA Government for such a transformation in 4 years. That would be an impossible timeframe in NSW, even just to agree a decision before flushing a fortune down the consultant toilet and then going back to the start. Thank god for Bradfield......
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Re: Only 8 Years ,Have we changed for the better?

Postby 6LW » Sun Jan 22, 2012 10:34 am

Well S.E.B, you have started a topic that should be very emotional for a number of people. Myself included.
As a driver, and I am not alone in this, traversing through the city block from north to south it has become more increasingly unbearable to the point where drivers are considering either moving to other depots where services uses Wellington Street bus station, don't go into the city very much or resigning. There are a number of bus enthusiasts considering their options.
It doesn't take a genius to work out that reducing a main artery into the CBD from 4-2 lanes will have an effect on how the traffic flow. Or more to the point, on how it doesn't flow! William Street appears to become 1 lane each way soon!
The city has become more and more unbearable "where your car is welcome". And what has it achieved? Honestly, when you think back to how it was, it's a huge step backwards especially for public transport users that really on buses traveling in and out of the city.
Is anyone still reading this or still awake? Lol.
As a result the City of Perth has made 371's much more enjoyable! Who would have thought it.
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Re: Only 8 Years ,Have we changed for the better?

Postby Mr OC Benz » Sun Jan 22, 2012 11:02 am

Similar opinion, although while I agree with 6LW with the ridiculous traffic lane changes and downsizing, two-way etc... it has caused the majority of chaos in the city, to the point where I find it is quicker to walk from Wellington St Bus Station to the Esplanade Busport rather than catching a bus that should only take 5-10mins at the most. The City of Perth have dug themselves a hole, it's only a matter of time until they admit they've stuffed up, probably won't be for a few years yet.

While I mention the above, I do believe that over the years, works related to public transport have improved in the City (rail wise). While the majority of this work hasn't affected many of the roads in the city, the PTA and relative organisations have managed to keep this under control. The only street that could possibly be a suspect would be William St and maybe Esplanade (but I don't remember too much of that being a problem). It has always had at least one or two lanes closed for quite a while now. It would've been at first from the construction of the underground railway, then the construction of buildings on top of it, the buildings on the east side of william St, and now the fact that they have to fix something on William St itself (not sure what it entirely relates to but I believe they didn't do the job properly somewhere, having to come back and repair) but it has caused enough problems to close lanes on William St.

The Perth City Link project should have minimal affect although of course there will be some line closures, deviations, bus way closures etc. But that's normal everywhere you go. Nothing in comparison to having Wellington St (Forest Place) and St Georges Tce closed at the same time or the reduction from 3 or 4 lanes to 1 or 2!!! It is meant to make it more pedestrian friendly, in which my opinion it has so far, but they've seemed to of forgotten about traffic management!
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Re: Only 8 Years ,Have we changed for the better?

Postby ADX666 » Sun Jan 22, 2012 11:43 am

Much better buses in traffic 8 years ago
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Re: Only 8 Years ,Have we changed for the better?

Postby jonwil » Sun Jan 22, 2012 11:48 am

The biggest problem plaguing the CBD has been the hole in the ground that has kept William Street closed and restricted for so long. And that isn't the fault of anyone in the government, council or PTA, that's the fault of various private companies that have taken far too long to dig what should have been a fairly simple tunnel.
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Re: Only 8 Years ,Have we changed for the better?

Postby laptop15 » Sun Jan 22, 2012 3:15 pm

For once the city is considering people not cars which is the right decision to make. Dont forget even though William is 1 lane each way Beaufort will be 2 each way so you have only lost one lane each way as well as this many streets are becoming two way wich will help traffic flow. It is no way a hole dug just give it time...
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Re: Only 8 Years ,Have we changed for the better?

Postby 6LW » Sun Jan 22, 2012 6:23 pm

I agree with you laptop15 in that they have made it better for pedestrians, and as you walk around the city that is evident. A lot of other changes in the CBD that have been a huge improvement which as a result have made it more attractive.
Re going 2way, keep in mind as William street becomes two way, the traffic turning right into Newcastle, Aberdeen, James and Roe will have to wait for pedestrians to cross whilst the signal is green. As a result something similar to St. Georges Terrace and William. Sometimes only allowing 2-4 vehicles through.
I don't want to rant about it too much as there are many scenarios to be considered.
Wasn't it in the 60's that it was changed from 2 way traffic due to better flow of traffic?
Oh, wasn't it last week that the City of Perth announced that they have a new system in place that notifies car users where there are available parking spaces free to reduce travel time and REDUCE EMISSIONS! Who are they trying to Kidd!
Anyone got a ladder? I need to get off my high horse. :D
Forgot to say. Great pictures there S.E.B!
Cheers.
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Re: Only 8 Years ,Have we changed for the better?

Postby Histrionic » Sun Jan 22, 2012 8:58 pm

laptop15 wrote:For once the city is considering people not cars which is the right decision to make. Dont forget even though William is 1 lane each way Beaufort will be 2 each way so you have only lost one lane each way as well as this many streets are becoming two way wich will help traffic flow. It is no way a hole dug just give it time...



Where I come from "people" are also considered to be such - in their cars - as they are ppl too!

Your city apperears to be artificially choked up which is crazy. Is this normal for you?
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Re: Only 8 Years ,Have we changed for the better?

Postby UQB709 » Sun Jan 22, 2012 10:49 pm

Re going 2way, keep in mind as William street becomes two way, the traffic turning right into Newcastle, Aberdeen, James and Roe will have to wait for pedestrians to cross whilst the signal is green. As a result something similar to St. Georges Terrace and William. Sometimes only allowing 2-4 vehicles through.


It is incredibly frustrating that WA insists on so often going overboard to separate pedestrians and turning traffic at signalised intersections. The current setup in William Street through Northbridge where so many intersections have a red arrow to stop cars whilst the pedestrian lights are green is just one example. Couple this with the seeming need with the new central city changes to not only revert roads to bi-directional but also to create multiple different turning arrows and you finish up with some ridiculously lengthy sequences of lights.
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Re: Only 8 Years ,Have we changed for the better?

Postby High Floor Bus » Sun Jan 22, 2012 11:55 pm

Well some raw nerves are tingling here too, which is of no suprise given the day to day chaos endured by us William st drivers.
I all up for the greater pedestrian thing ,But it has to be practical for all interest ,not not just one group of the public.
Take William st between Newcastle & Roe sts, was 4 lanes now two lanes with island parking & trees on both sides and larger footpaths.
A more practical streetscape would have 3 lanes one being a bus lane ,& street parking on one side only with trees both sides together with the larger footpaths.
Now onto the Horseshoe Bridge ,4 lanes in two by removing a lane for a larger footpath that does not need that extra pedestrian space.
Again no for thought here, A dedicated bus lane over the bridge would keep the buses away from fighting there way through traffic.
Before the street work program started ,it use to take about 6 mins from the top of the Horseshoe Bridge down to the Esplanade busport.
Now it can take as long as 20 mins in average traffic conditions ,let alone when the ""S*#T hits the Fan"" caused by some minor traffic incident.
Which brings me to another point ,With our old 3 & 4 lane roads,if one lane became redundant due to accident/breakdown there was plenty of capacity in the remaning lanes for traffic to flow.
But with this twoway rubbish,one car stops we all stop. :( A real nightmare for emergency services to get around.
Just look what the rephasing of traffic lights did for William st for the CHOGM week.
In the end who wants to be in the city now days,no matter how pedestrian freindly it is now , it just plain simply stinks from all the car fumes stuck in gridlock.
Allmost 8 years on.
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William & Wellington st 02-12-2011
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Thats my 2.2 cents again.
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Re: Only 8 Years ,Have we changed for the better?

Postby Histrionic » Mon Jan 23, 2012 8:36 pm

Your city is choked by politically correct motivations. Singapore: 5 million+ people and flowing smoother than your "paradise".
Singapore is very small; 45x30square kilometres to the maximum with a minimum of the fuss.

perth - frustrating it seems, and quite boring by comparison. I also see it is quite dangerous to inhabit. I can not understand why.
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Re: Only 8 Years ,Have we changed for the better?

Postby busdriver12 » Mon Jan 23, 2012 9:31 pm

When I was relieving in Operations at Karrinyup in 2004, I was sent into Wellington St to observe the effect of the recently started road works in Wellington and William Sts. I grabbed my camera and positioned myself on the now defunct Raine Square overpass from WSBS and took some photos. The date was 1st November 2004. I did take a video with the camera but the quality was too grainy (noisy) :(

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Re: Only 8 Years ,Have we changed for the better?

Postby actually » Mon Jan 23, 2012 9:51 pm

I used to love doing city runs all day long now it makes my stomach churn. Time to ring the bell and get off.
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Re: Only 8 Years ,Have we changed for the better?

Postby Bus-1809 » Tue Jan 24, 2012 6:59 am

The city how it used to be, EL Falcon Taxi's, DAB's, the old City Beach Bus Stop outside Raine Square, the old King Kong Shop at the corner of William and Murray (where the underground now stands), the old Bus Lane on to the freeway from the Busport onto the freeway! Some really good memories there HFB. Cheers :)
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Re: Only 8 Years ,Have we changed for the better?

Postby High Floor Bus » Wed Jan 25, 2012 4:40 pm

The city how it used to be, EL Falcon Taxi's, DAB's, the old City Beach Bus Stop outside Raine Square, the old King Kong Shop at the corner of William and Murray (where the underground now stands), the old Bus Lane on to the freeway from the Busport onto the freeway! Some really good memories there HFB. Cheers

I cannot take all the credit here , some realy good shots to show "how we were'..Perth that is belong to Busdriver 12 aswell :) cheers.

Here are a few more flashbacks to a time not so long ago when Perth had a more of laidback big country town feeling than todays Dog eat Dog ,Get outa ma way,Eat this attitude. of a city. :roll:

Here are a couple of shots of the buildings prior to the Tunnel works & the 401 0n Williams st and raine square development.
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Crn William & Wellington sts perth 05-2004
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A rather run down Wellington buildings & UQB547 in front.
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Wellington building & UQB547
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looking north to the horseshoe bridge on William st is the old Mitchells Building.
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Mitchells Buildings on William st 05-4004
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And looking south.
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Mitchells Buildings on William st 05-4004
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UQB729? or 720? laying over in the old busway & old railcar sidings.
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UQB729?
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The pre Tunnel track crossover & siding entry with the now demolished Entertainment center.
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Old track crossovers
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a view from the Horseshoe with 4 x 2 car in the old 4 branch line set up (Midland- Fremantle)-(Armadale-Joondalup).
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4 x 2 car at perth
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The platforms in the next shots changed in their track configuration to accomadate the Mandurah tunnel in the following years constuction, there fate has been sealed and are disappearing fast as the NorthBridge Link Trackwork sinking constuction goes ahead at full steam ahead.
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Old West end platforms Perth (Armadale-Joondalup Lines)
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Old West end platforms Perth (Midland -Fremantle lines)
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The Old Fwy South overpasses came down to make way for the tunnel track entrance & the Esplanade Station.
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Old Fwy South overpasses
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Enjoy. :D
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Re: Only 8 Years ,Have we changed for the better?

Postby Bedford-29 » Wed Jan 25, 2012 8:49 pm

What would be interesting is to have some pictures dating back 40,50,60 years or more.Same as the pictures posted with maybe trams or trolleybuses in them as old picture are good at comparing a city at what it looks like then and into future.
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Re: Only 8 Years ,Have we changed for the better?

Postby High Floor Bus » Wed Jan 25, 2012 10:44 pm

What would be interesting is to have some pictures dating back 40,50,60 years or more.Same as the pictures posted with maybe trams or trolleybuses in them as old picture are good at comparing a city at what it looks like then and into future.

In answer to your "Q" ,this might be to interest you .
Might have missed this series of threads 6 months ago. :wink:
Links to Pts 1,2&3 here viewtopic.php?f=46&t=60601Va

"Edit" you have seen & posted in it "doh" :wink:
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Re: Only 8 Years ,Have we changed for the better?

Postby Bus-1809 » Wed Jan 25, 2012 11:52 pm

More fantastic Shots there HFB! Well done to you and BD12!
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