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GM PD4107

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GM PD4107

Postby Shagger » Tue Aug 13, 2013 4:02 am

Hello,
I have just got hold of an old Ansett Pioneer bus, its a "Buffalo bus" GM PD 4107. I believe that AP brought in 35 of these bus and I dont know how many are left on the road and or if anyone knows much about them. I have only just taken possession of it this week and I about to pull the motor/transmission out and give it the once over.
I am hoping that someone out there can help me with things as I go. I dont know what yet but I am sure things will pop up.
It has been sitting in a shed for the last 20 years and only seen daylight once in that time. they tires still had air in them and when we put air into its tanks the airbags came up.
The mechanic has had the injectors outand the motor doesnt turn over hence why its coming out
I will get some photos of it. Shes a beauty
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Re: GM PD4107

Postby alan4106au » Tue Aug 13, 2013 2:11 pm

G’Day Shagger
Pioneer had 35 new PD4106’s and six second-hand.
On the road here from January 1962 through to September 1964 for the new ones.
27 only 4107’s and after right hand conversion they were to hit the road in August 1967 through to September 1968.
Let your mechanic know that the engine is left hand rotation ( if he doesn’t already) the only thing different is one camshaft!
Let us know the Chassis No. It will be found in the compartment under the driver’s seat (on the edge of the step) it will be PD 4107 and four more Nos. Also on the plate to your left as you enter the coach if it’s still there .
Congratulation on the purchase. What plans do you have for it?
Still a lot of them up and going parts are not a problem.
Check out the Flxible clipper club web site http://flxibleclipperclub.com.au

Safe motoring Alan
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Re: GM PD4107

Postby Shagger » Thu Aug 15, 2013 6:10 am

Hi Alan
The chassis number is 1027. it still has the plate on the front panel.
I have got a Detroit engine specialist working on it. He has been working on Detroit engines for 40 years and never worked on one like this with the slanted V8 and the "V" drive transmission.
I have got the motor out right now and looking at things it will need a complete overhaul (Damn) but I think in the long run of it all its probably good to get it out and fix t up now anyway.
What do you know about these things? If you know anything about these or this one I would be interested. I would like to build a journal about it/them to have in the bus
I am thinking of turning it into a motorhome. I want to keep the lines on the outside so I m thinking of not attaching on solar panel etc to the outside and for the awning, going old school and using a manual track to slide on the awning.
But I am still open for ideas on what to do with it and any help is good help

Lets stay in touch, I live on the Gold Coast
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Re: GM PD4107

Postby Bedford-29 » Thu Aug 15, 2013 8:58 am

PD 4107 was by the look of South Australia registered but here is a picture of it in its former coach days.Picture from the Ken Magor collection.
Pioneer Express  PD4107.jpg
PIONEER EXPRESS PD 4107
Pioneer Express PD4107.jpg (97.49 KiB) Viewed 6307 times
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Re: GM PD4107

Postby boronia » Thu Aug 15, 2013 6:57 pm

Hi Shagger

Congratulations on your purchase. I drove these for a few years in the early 1980s, and I rate them as probably the most enjoyable vehicle I have ever driven. They were way ahead of the time by local standards way back then, and I don't think many modern buses have really caught up yet.

Once you get it sorted and running, and you learn how to drive it properly, you will have a lot of fun. Good luck finding reverse gear :shock:

Mechanically they are straightforward and easy to work on. The only thing that concerns me with them is the bodywork - they were built like a plane, a tubular saloon with the bins suspended underneath and the cab and engine compartment cantilevered off the ends. Metal fatigue may be a problem around the rear end.
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Re: GM PD4107

Postby Shagger » Thu Aug 15, 2013 7:42 pm

Thanks guys for your replies,ideas and photo.
Yes Bedford that looks exactly like my one, I can tell by the GM badge in the front, most of the other ones I have seen have a slightly different badge. Are you saying that 4107 1027 was from Sth Aust or registered there? I love the photo.
boronia - I followed the bus up the road on the float when I took it to my workshop. the air was up and it looked like it handled the bumps and corner very well.. I thought.
Are you saying that even in the Auto transmission that reverse is had to find? The linkages for the gears seem a little loose and sloppy and if reverse is difficult maybe I will look at them more closely before I put the motor back in,
I am have the motor our now and it is getting a complete overhaul. While the motor is out I am going to renew the wiring just because it is old and I dont know really what condition they are in, replace the airbags, paint all of the motor bay. I am not sure whether to replace the old fuel filters with the new screw on kind, upgrade the alternator, or change other upgradable parts or keep it original under the bonnet. I believe that they worked alright in there day and I think it will keep its classic feel. What do you guys think, should I upgrade or keep it original?
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Re: GM PD4107

Postby boronia » Thu Aug 15, 2013 8:49 pm

I haven't driven an auto version, originally they were all manual 4 speeds. I recall Murrays converted a couple over with second hand parts from USA. This took all the fun out of driving them. They also modified the a/c compressors on a couple.

Reverse in a manual requires putting the box in 1st, pushing a button on the dash, and moving the lever back to the 2nd position. There is a solenoid in the box that moves a selector rod; sometimes this would stick and it wouldn't come out of reverse.

Re the badge, some had GM, some had GMC.

Has yours got sliding windows like the photo, or fixed glass? The latter was a Pioneer mod when they went from express work to sightseeing tours.
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Re: GM PD4107

Postby Bedford-29 » Thu Aug 15, 2013 10:20 pm

Mate have a read of this.
www.wikipedia.org/wiki/GM_Buffalo_bus
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Re: GM PD4107

Postby Shagger » Fri Aug 16, 2013 4:04 am

Thanks again guys for your help :P
I have looked at the wikipedia site as soon as I started looking at the bus. I have been scouring the internet for as much as possible the find out what they are about.
One thing that I really would like to get and thats a wiring diagram for them. I was going to replace the main wiring loom from the back to the front while I had the motor out. I saw on "bus conversions.com" bulletin board that someone had one to share but I cant seem to get accepted onto the board. I joined a couple of weeks ago but still haven't heard back yet so i cant post anything on it.

Thank goodness I didnt get the manual trans. It sounds like an art on its own.

I will get some photos of it for you to look at. I had some but I cant find them on my computer or phone "Doh"
It will be up on block but you will get the idea.

Let me know if these photos come thru. I am not sure if I have done it right
If they did this is the bus when we first pulled it out of the shed so it is dirty but you can see the lines and markings

/Users/Kingshagger/Desktop/GM bus/GM Photos/Bus 1.JPG

/Users/Kingshagger/Desktop/GM bus/GM Photos/photo 2.JPG
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Re: GM PD4107

Postby alan4106au » Fri Aug 16, 2013 10:26 am

G’Day Shagger

Your bus was D 705 in the Pioneer fleet and went on the road in September 1967
You are able to get a CD with the complete workshop manual (Including the wiring schematic) from the states.
You will find that parts like the air bags and steering components are a lot cheaper from the states than here.
You mention something about upgrading the Alternator??
The original would be very hard to beat and is able to produce over 300 Amps.
This could be a real asset if you want to run thing such as 240 volt Ac/heat pump that would be a lot cheaper and more practical than running the original that was over kill even with 45 bums on board. And could be very useful in a motor home situation to bring the house batteries up quickly.
If I was you I would look very hard at what you have! It is very hard to UPGRADE something that is already very reliable and proven. Price the new type spin on filters against the original and you may (as I have) stick with the old type.
You will need to carry a very good sturdy step ladder if you fit a rail for you’re awning! It’s a long way from the ground to the top of the windows.

Check this group out.
http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/gmc-busnuts/

Good luck with it
Alan
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Re: GM PD4107

Postby boronia » Fri Aug 16, 2013 9:08 pm

Although the 4107 is only about 10.5 m long, it has a relatively long wheelbase and a large turning circle. So you need to drive it like a 14.5, with plenty of room to swing at corners. Despite this, it is surprisingly maneuverable, and I can recall taking it places I would now have second thoughts about driving my car.

You probably will never get a chance to experience this these days, but they will cruise comfortably in excess of 120.
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Re: GM PD4107

Postby makeminea2stroke » Fri Aug 16, 2013 10:16 pm

Hi Shagger

I'm on The Busconversions.com board. let me know some more details if I can help you

Cheerz
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Re: GM PD4107

Postby Shagger » Mon Aug 19, 2013 5:22 pm

I have just been accepted on Busconversions.com board. They apologies for the delay so all is good.
The owners have just called me and they have found original workshop manual too so I will get that this week Yeah!
Thanks alan4016 for the original bus number (Pioneer bus D 705) I am going to see if I can jag a picture somewhere of this bus in its glory.

Thanks Guys
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Re: GM PD4107

Postby Shagger » Mon Aug 19, 2013 5:23 pm

Did the photos of my bus come through OK
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Re: GM PD4107

Postby Fleet Lists » Mon Aug 19, 2013 5:32 pm

I have not seen any photos come through.
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Re: GM PD4107

Postby boronia » Mon Aug 19, 2013 5:57 pm

Shagger wrote:
Let me know if these photos come thru. I am not sure if I have done it right
If they did this is the bus when we first pulled it out of the shed so it is dirty but you can see the lines and markings

/Users/Kingshagger/Desktop/GM bus/GM Photos/Bus 1.JPG

/Users/Kingshagger/Desktop/GM bus/GM Photos/photo 2.JPG

You haven't given the full URL.
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Re: GM PD4107

Postby Shagger » Thu Aug 22, 2013 7:11 pm

Did this photo come thru?
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Re: GM PD4107

Postby Fleet Lists » Thu Aug 22, 2013 7:24 pm

Yes - see for yourself.
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Re: GM PD4107

Postby Shagger » Fri Sep 20, 2013 6:35 am

HI Guys, An update on the bus, I have had the motor rebuilt and it was running the other weekend. It is still at the mechanics shop and over the next couple of weeks I will be repainting it and replacing the hoses before it goes back in. But excited!
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Re: GM PD4107

Postby kelly » Mon Sep 30, 2013 7:27 pm

hi, what a great find and it looks to be in good shape also, cant say i was a fan of the window converstions they took away the classic style of the coach. it will be worth the effort to get it up and running. any body who has ever driven them and other ansett pioneer drivers will tell you they were the best on the road. i was based in brisbane in the 70,s always looked forward to taking them on the road there was one of them i think it was unit no was 727 which whent like the clappers mabey it had a high ratio diff or the motor was unrestriced but it was a dream to drive. i did a rescue mission to charlville in it once to pick up passangers off a broken down pd4106. i got to charlville quicker than i could drive my car there. the gear change could be a bugger at times as each coach had its own quirks. you just pretended you dident hear those grinding noises down the back but the must have been pritty alaming to the back seat passangers. i did a trip through the u.s. using greyhound in the back blocks of some of the states private bus companys run the services. notice i used the word bus a u.s. term, pioneer drivers always refer to them as coaches un less of coarse they were giving trouble like changing a wheel in pelting down rain other words were used and they wernt bus or coach. while in the states i was offerd a drive of an auto pd4107 dident knock that offer back, it was fast and not a squeak out of it. a friend wanted me to buy his extended flixi clipper a few years back it was half converted to a motor home, my mate rebuilt the kitchen it. as much as i would have liked to own i passed it up. i can only drive a mobility scooter now so it would have been something to look at if not to drive. all the best with your pd4107 you will not regrete it. regards bill kelly
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Re: GM PD4107

Postby Shagger » Tue Oct 01, 2013 6:39 pm

Hi Billy, Thanks for the info, You sound like a real fan of these coaches. I would like to find out more about the coach and where it ran. "alan4106au" believes it was registered in Sth Aust going off the chassis number.
I have been on holidays and only got back today so hpefully I will have the engine back in soon, I want to paint the motor before I add new hoses to it and then put it back in. Keep sending helpful tips.
Where do you live? Maybe one day I might be in your area and take you for a run for old times sake
Thanks
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Re: GM PD4107

Postby kelly » Sun Oct 06, 2013 2:41 pm

hi shagger, if i remember right i think south australia was the only state that these coaches could be regesterded when ansett first got them. they ran mainly south of brisbane on the coast route and the inland route to sydney plus through to melbourne via west wylong which is as far as brisbane based drivers went. the ran sometimes to cairns when a pd4106 was not available. during the 60,s and 70,s queensland roads were shockers the pd4106,s did a fantastic job of holding up to the punishment. i dont think our roads have inproved much sinse then, the jumbos as we called the pd4107,s were renouned for floating & rolling which caused a bit of travell sickness for some passangers, aircraft sick bags were provided. ansett fitted roll bars to them which settled them down. out of all the coaches that i have driven encluding dennings m/benz and scaina in new zealand, the jumbo would still be my choice. will take you up for a ride in your jumbo when she is back on the road. cheers bill p.s. if you would like to see some photos of a couple of ansett pioneer coaches after they went under water in the 74 floods let me know.
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Re: GM PD4107

Postby boronia » Sun Oct 06, 2013 3:56 pm

out of all the coaches that i have driven encluding dennings m/benz and scaina, the jumbo would still be my choice


With about 3 years of Jumbo driving experience myself, I would agree with this statement.

Put me down for a ride too please.
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Re: GM PD4107

Postby dominodc122 » Mon Oct 14, 2013 4:56 pm

Hell...we'll all chip in for the diesel and come for a ride ...what a great find!!! :shock: :D Being a coach fan (and ex Ansett Pioneer driver) I would love to see this restored - but she is your beastie Shagger - ENJOY!!! :D :D :D
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Re: GM PD4107

Postby alan4106au » Tue Mar 18, 2014 10:39 pm

Just wondering how much progress you have made.
Love to know how it is coming on??
I have a 4106 for sale at the moment and only advertised at this stage on the Flxible clipper site.
On for sale due to health reasons. http://flxibleclipperclub.com.au/wp/
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