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Liberal parties plans for overhaul of the Public Transport N

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Liberal parties plans for overhaul of the Public Transport N

Postby jibb » Fri Mar 09, 2018 5:23 pm

The Liberal Party have released a 16 page document with their plans for our Public Transport Network ,including creating the South Australian Public Transport Authority tasked with the job of running and planning the network. It will have a dedicated CEO who will report directly to the Minister.
This is not before time as Public Transport with DPTI has taken a back seat with poor leadership and inefficiencies

details are here;-http://www.strongplan.com.au/policy/public-transport

When you open up the document there is the pdf you can download with the whole plan.
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Re: Liberal parties plans for overhaul of the Public Transpo

Postby system improver » Fri Mar 09, 2018 7:23 pm

They are promising to do nothing - other than investigate, look into and consider things or ask other bodies to investigate, look into or consider things. Given that Liberal governments usually cut services, that might be a good outcome.
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Re: Liberal parties plans for overhaul of the Public Transpo

Postby busrider » Fri Mar 09, 2018 7:28 pm

Also, their plan to reduce the price of a 28 day pass on Metrocards is something that's already being implemented, that starts next month.
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Re: Liberal parties plans for overhaul of the Public Transpo

Postby Newcastle Flyer » Sat Mar 17, 2018 10:05 pm

Since the Liberals have won (& no wonder)

I wonder if that means the cancellation of the extension(s) of the electric network?
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Re: Liberal parties plans for overhaul of the Public Transpo

Postby tonyp » Sun Mar 18, 2018 7:46 am

Here's a direct link to the pdf:

https://strongplan.com.au/wp-content/up ... NSPORT.pdf

There's obviously a lot of professional input into this. I find it all very positive and encouraging. Let's hope that they can implement it fully.
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Re: Liberal parties plans for overhaul of the Public Transpo

Postby Fleet Lists » Sun Mar 18, 2018 9:41 am

Have you ever known one of these election plans to be implemented in full?
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Re: Liberal parties plans for overhaul of the Public Transpo

Postby tonyp » Sun Mar 18, 2018 10:48 am

Fleet Lists wrote:Have you ever known one of these election plans to be implemented in full?

Give me a year to research and I'll come back to you on that! :wink:
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Re: Liberal parties plans for overhaul of the Public Transpo

Postby Skexis » Sun Mar 18, 2018 4:47 pm

From reading the bullet points on Page 4 it seems mostly to be generic promises with no real goals. I'll be interested to see what kind of network hierarchy they will come up with and how they'll simplify the already simple Go Zones. Oh, and the simplest way to increase patronage is to reduce fares.

No mention of cancelling the proposed tram extension into North Adelaide though, or was this only an election promise that hadn't reached any significant planning stage?
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Re: Liberal parties plans for overhaul of the Public Transpo

Postby torrens117 » Sun Mar 18, 2018 5:25 pm

The tram extension to North Adelaide will go ahead and terminate at the junction of Prospect Rd and Main North Rd.
Last edited by torrens117 on Sun Mar 18, 2018 10:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Liberal parties plans for overhaul of the Public Transpo

Postby Fleet Lists » Sun Mar 18, 2018 5:29 pm

On what authority do you have that?
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Re: Liberal parties plans for overhaul of the Public Transpo

Postby tonyp » Sun Mar 18, 2018 6:08 pm

Fleet Lists wrote:On what authority do you have that?

It's shown in the map and described in the PDF of the Liberals policy, link posted above.

Sure, whether it will all happen ...
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Re: Liberal parties plans for overhaul of the Public Transpo

Postby burrumbus » Sun Mar 18, 2018 6:16 pm

We'll find out in due course with the election of the Libs in SA.
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Re: Liberal parties plans for overhaul of the Public Transpo

Postby torrens117 » Sun Mar 18, 2018 10:32 pm

Route 1 – Glenelg Tram Extension to North Adelaide
• 2 km extension north with four new tram stops in North Adelaide
• To operate every 10 minutes from 6 am to 7 pm Mondays to Saturdays; every 15 minutes until midnight every day and on Sundays and public holidays
• Maintains simple straight alignment to connect key attractors including Adelaide Oval and the O’Connell Street commercial and restaurant district

Route 2 – Entertainment Centre to City via East End
• 2.8 km of track extension from North Terrace into East Terrace, Hutt Street, Angas Street and Gouger Street with eight new tram stops connecting with North Terrace cultural institutions, East End, Hutt Street and Gouger Street restaurant areas including China Town, and the Central Market
• To operate every 10 minutes from 6 am to 7 pm Mondays to Saturdays; every 15 minutes until midnight every day and on Sundays and public holidays

Route 3 – Loop service
• Right-turn at King William Street-North Terrace intersection onto Route 2
• Left hand turn at Angas Street onto Route 1
• To operate during school peak times and for weekends and special events to connect the Glenelg Tramline to cultural and educational institutions on North Terrace East, the Adelaide Botanic High School, the old Royal Adelaide Hospital site, the East End and Hutt Street

Route 4 – New Royal Adelaide Hospital to South Terrace Shuttle
• Transfer connections with Route 1 at Victoria Square and Rundle Mall tram stops and with Route 2 at Adelaide Railway Station tram stop
• To operate weekdays every 10 minutes from 7 am to 7 pm
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Re: Liberal parties plans for overhaul of the Public Transpo

Postby TA3001 » Sun Mar 18, 2018 11:10 pm

Assuming that all these proposals go ahead, will there be another depot built to reduce the amount of dead running from Glengowrie? Tram drivers don't work for free!
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Re: Liberal parties plans for overhaul of the Public Transpo

Postby jibb » Mon Mar 19, 2018 6:21 am

TA3001 wrote:Assuming that all these proposals go ahead, will there be another depot built to reduce the amount of dead running from Glengowrie? Tram drivers don't work for free!

Glengowrie Depot can't hold any more trams-additional new trams purchased will be stored at a new Depot. Several sites have been mentioned including part of the Australia Post Depot on Grote Street.
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Re: Liberal parties plans for overhaul of the Public Transpo

Postby Tim Williams » Mon Mar 19, 2018 9:33 am

I think these new proposed extensions by the Libs are far more practical (and affordable) including the North Adelaide section serving the Oval and Children's Hospital. I do agree that a city or near city sub -depot seems to be needed.

The other strong feeling I have is about the visual state of the trams - they are, quite frankly, very scruffy, with overall advertising covering windows, touched up/repaired paintwork that does not match the existing paint and generally tired looking interiors. I have just come back from Hong Kong and those wonderful old looking (but not necessarily old) double deck trams are mostly covered in overall adverts that look colourful, bright and tidy but DO NO COVER THE WINDOWS and generally the trams look clean and tidy, ours do not!!!! There are over 160 of these d/deck trams operating intensively in Hong Kong - if they can keep their fleet looking clean and tidy, why can't we do the same?
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Re: Liberal parties plans for overhaul of the Public Transpo

Postby jibb » Mon Mar 19, 2018 9:45 am

Tim Williams wrote:I think these new proposed extensions by the Libs are far more practical (and affordable) including the North Adelaide section serving the Oval and Children's Hospital. I do agree that a city or near city sub -depot seems to be needed.

The other strong feeling I have is about the visual state of the trams - they are, quite frankly, very scruffy, with overall advertising covering windows, touched up/repaired paintwork that does not match the existing paint and generally tired looking interiors. I have just come back from Hong Kong and those wonderful old looking (but not necessarily old) double deck trams are mostly covered in overall adverts that look colourful, bright and tidy but DO NO COVER THE WINDOWS and generally the trams look clean and tidy, ours do not!!!! There are over 160 of these d/deck trams operating intensively in Hong Kong - if they can keep their fleet looking clean and tidy, why can't we do the same?

Most of them look very dirty-they don't seem to get washed very often--why?
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Re: Liberal parties plans for overhaul of the Public Transpo

Postby burrumbus » Mon Mar 19, 2018 10:14 am

Agreed with both of you Tim and Jibb.But still much better than the presentation of the Melbourne tram fleet,which is very scruffy indeed.
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Re: Liberal parties plans for overhaul of the Public Transpo

Postby tonyp » Mon Mar 19, 2018 10:27 am

There are many agencies/operators around the world that have enough respect for their passengers to not cover the windows with AOA wrap, but Australia isn't generally one of them, unfortunately (except that in Perth it only seems to be in discreet small panels). When it's open slather on buses here, it's not really possible to argue a different set of rules for trams. There are many examples overseas of creative approaches to AOA that don't muck around with passengers' view too much, but here public transport seems to be contemptuously regarded as nothing more than a mobile billboard.
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Re: Liberal parties plans for overhaul of the Public Transpo

Postby Tim Williams » Mon Mar 19, 2018 11:16 am

Agree with you (Tonyp), I see no need for any bus or tram to cover the windows with the so called contra vision, which as said previously, at night or when it rains, is difficult to see through. In both Singapore and Hong Kong, the area of contra vision i think is well controlled and I also think, in the case of Singapore, has been reduced.

If you look a trams in Europe, there seems to be a pride in their appearance, with advertising well restrained!!
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Re: Liberal parties plans for overhaul of the Public Transpo

Postby tonyp » Tue Mar 20, 2018 7:39 am

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Re: Liberal parties plans for overhaul of the Public Transpo

Postby system improver » Tue Mar 20, 2018 8:14 am

torrens117 wrote:Route 1 – Glenelg Tram Extension to North Adelaide
• 2 km extension north with four new tram stops in North Adelaide
• To operate every 10 minutes from 6 am to 7 pm Mondays to Saturdays; every 15 minutes until midnight every day and on Sundays and public holidays
• Maintains simple straight alignment to connect key attractors including Adelaide Oval and the O’Connell Street commercial and restaurant district

Route 2 – Entertainment Centre to City via East End
• 2.8 km of track extension from North Terrace into East Terrace, Hutt Street, Angas Street and Gouger Street with eight new tram stops connecting with North Terrace cultural institutions, East End, Hutt Street and Gouger Street restaurant areas including China Town, and the Central Market
• To operate every 10 minutes from 6 am to 7 pm Mondays to Saturdays; every 15 minutes until midnight every day and on Sundays and public holidays

Route 3 – Loop service
• Right-turn at King William Street-North Terrace intersection onto Route 2
• Left hand turn at Angas Street onto Route 1
• To operate during school peak times and for weekends and special events to connect the Glenelg Tramline to cultural and educational institutions on North Terrace East, the Adelaide Botanic High School, the old Royal Adelaide Hospital site, the East End and Hutt Street

Route 4 – New Royal Adelaide Hospital to South Terrace Shuttle
• Transfer connections with Route 1 at Victoria Square and Rundle Mall tram stops and with Route 2 at Adelaide Railway Station tram stop
• To operate weekdays every 10 minutes from 7 am to 7 pm

Most of these were Labor's policy, not the LNP's. So they won't be built. The only tram infrastructure promise made by the Libs was, "... to build a right-hand turn from King William Road onto North Terrace." No additional services will operate, it will just provide very expensive "flexibility". Why not make it a grand union?
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Re: Liberal parties plans for overhaul of the Public Transpo

Postby system improver » Tue Mar 20, 2018 8:18 am

Tim Williams wrote:I think these new proposed extensions by the Libs are far more practical (and affordable) including the North Adelaide section serving the Oval and Children's Hospital...

As can be seen in their policy document, the Liberal party did not promise any new tram lines but instead pledged to build a right-hand turn from King William Road onto North Terrace. A new qango will "look into" various ideas - which is code for coming up with a "plan" to do think about doing something in their tenth term.
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Re: Liberal parties plans for overhaul of the Public Transpo

Postby jibb » Tue Mar 20, 2018 9:38 pm

The 37 million for the right-hand turn from Kin William Street into North Terrace also includes the purchase of additional trams(over and above what we already have).
Services from Glenelg will alternate with one service going via North Terrace to the East End.The next service will continue via King William Road to eventually North Adelaide.
The Shuttle service will be reintroduced with trams running from South Terrace to West Terrace(nRAH).
Services to and from The Entertainment Centre will operate via Port Road and North Terrace to East Terrace.
Passengers from Glenelg who wish to alight at either Adelaide Railway Station,Morphett Street or nRAH will be able to transfer at King William Street stops.
This is different to what was proposed by the previous Government.

system improver wrote:
torrens117 wrote:Route 1 – Glenelg Tram Extension to North Adelaide
• 2 km extension north with four new tram stops in North Adelaide
• To operate every 10 minutes from 6 am to 7 pm Mondays to Saturdays; every 15 minutes until midnight every day and on Sundays and public holidays
• Maintains simple straight alignment to connect key attractors including Adelaide Oval and the O’Connell Street commercial and restaurant district

Route 2 – Entertainment Centre to City via East End
• 2.8 km of track extension from North Terrace into East Terrace, Hutt Street, Angas Street and Gouger Street with eight new tram stops connecting with North Terrace cultural institutions, East End, Hutt Street and Gouger Street restaurant areas including China Town, and the Central Market
• To operate every 10 minutes from 6 am to 7 pm Mondays to Saturdays; every 15 minutes until midnight every day and on Sundays and public holidays

Route 3 – Loop service
• Right-turn at King William Street-North Terrace intersection onto Route 2
• Left hand turn at Angas Street onto Route 1
• To operate during school peak times and for weekends and special events to connect the Glenelg Tramline to cultural and educational institutions on North Terrace East, the Adelaide Botanic High School, the old Royal Adelaide Hospital site, the East End and Hutt Street

Route 4 – New Royal Adelaide Hospital to South Terrace Shuttle
• Transfer connections with Route 1 at Victoria Square and Rundle Mall tram stops and with Route 2 at Adelaide Railway Station tram stop
• To operate weekdays every 10 minutes from 7 am to 7 pm

Most of these were Labor's policy, not the LNP's. So they won't be built. The only tram infrastructure promise made by the Libs was, "... to build a right-hand turn from King William Road onto North Terrace." No additional services will operate, it will just provide very expensive "flexibility". Why not make it a grand union?
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Re: Liberal parties plans for overhaul of the Public Transpo

Postby tonyp » Wed Mar 21, 2018 5:40 am

I read the Liberals plan with regard to trams as being fundamentally different philosophically from what Labor was proposing. Labor's long-term objective was more lines out into the suburbs. The Liberals are arguing that this is presently unsustainable for trams and can be done by buses (which is correct because the density and activity along these corridors is pretty light-on and probably won't change much in the short to medium-term future), whereas trams have a much more justifiable role as inner city circulators on corridors that are going to have much heavier patronage.

As one who has worked on tram projects elsewhere, I find their policy document very professionally-informed and realistic in terms of the Adelaide economy and prospects for future growth. It certainly doesn't prevent new lines being built out along suburban corridors in the future if things change. It's consolidating and improving the core of the system. They're saying that their proposals will be submitted to Infrastructure SA (is this DPTI SA?) for detailed analysis, which is what any government would normally do.

Whether any government of either political side will actually act on what it promises at an election remains to be seen of course - no discrimination between either party there.
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