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Transdev Doncaster Busway Proposal

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Transdev Doncaster Busway Proposal

Postby MAN 16.242 » Thu Jun 08, 2017 9:08 am

http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/bid-t ... wie1z.html

Doncaster to CBD: Special busway may run down middle of Hoddle Street
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Adam Carey
53 mins ago


The plan for Melbourne's first rapid busway
Melbourne's first ever designated busway may run down the middle of Hoddle Street with bumper-sized bendy buses running every three minutes between East Doncaster and Southern Cross Station.

Global transport giant Transdev has pitched to the Andrews government a proposal to build and operate the "Doncaster bus rapid transit" system for 30 years and reinvent public transport in Melbourne's eastern suburbs.


The French-based company, which has a contract to operate a third of Melbourne's bus network, wants to build and run the premium bus service as a public-private partnership.

The rapid transit busway would be a first for Melbourne, but would mirror international examples Transdev operates in cities such as Nantes in France and Bogota in Colombia.

Senior ministers have been briefed on the proposal, including Treasurer Tim Pallas and Public Transport Minister Jacinta Allan.

Transdev and infrastructure developer John Laing submitted the idea late last month, using the Department of Treasury's market-led proposal guidelines – the same process Transurban used to gain approval for its West Gate Tunnel project.


It is estimated the Doncaster-CBD busway would cost more than $500 million to build, which is 10 to 16 per cent of the estimated $3 billion - $5 billion cost of building Doncaster rail, a project Infrastructure Victoria assessed last year would return just 10 cents for every dollar spent.

Transdev wants to pave over the Eastern Freeway median – which has been reserved for almost 50 years for a future Doncaster railway line – for express buses instead of trains.


The buses would be double-articulated, with doors on both sides like trains and trams, and big enough to fit up to 150 passengers. They would run every three minutes in the peak and every five to six minutes off-peak.

Platform bus stops would have myki readers so buses would not be delayed while passengers touch on and off.

New bus "stations" would potentially be built at intersections above the Eastern Freeway, at Chandler Highway, Burke Road and Bulleen Road. This would involve building platforms over the freeway, with escalators and lifts down to road level.


From the Eastern Freeway the busway would join Hoddle Street via a dedicated ramp, then potentially follow Victoria Parade and Lonsdale Street to a new underground bus terminus at the northern end of Southern Cross Station.

If the busway followed Lonsdale Street, the trees and on-street car parks in the median would be replaced by bus lanes and platform stops.

Express bus lanes would also be built in the centre of Doncaster Road, running from the current park and ride bus terminus, which would be expanded with a new underground car park, to a new bus terminus at Donvale Hospital.


Other vehicles such as cars and trucks would be strictly banned from the busway.

Modelling by engineering consultancy AECOM found the bus rapid transit system would provide a reliable 30-minute journey between Doncaster and Southern Cross station.

Currently that journey takes 47 minutes or more in the peak due to inner-city traffic jams.

AECOM forecast the service would be used by 24,000 people in the combined morning and afternoon peaks, roughly eight times more than use the current Doncaster bus routes to the city.

Transdev argues its busway would be more like a railway, with superior travel speeds and service consistency, than a conventional bus route.

The busway would not preclude future construction of Doncaster rail in the freeway median.

The concept has already won the support of the Eastern Transport Coalition, a group of seven eastern suburbs councils pushing for better transport in Melbourne's east.

The Coalition said traffic congestion on Hoddle Street, Lonsdale Street and at the end of the Eastern Freeway "compromises travel time" for Doncaster buses, which are the only public transport between Manningham and the city.

It endorsed a bus rapid transit system in its Commuters Count campaign, launched this week.

Monash University's Professor Graham Currie helped to design Melbourne's current SmartBus network and said many cities had chosen bus rapid transit systems as an effective and less expensive alternative to rail.

"It's a rubber-tyred railway, the new technology dominating public transport thinking on planet Earth," he said of the concept.

BRISBANE, AUSTRALIA - DECEMBER 21: wrap around bus advertising in Brisbane's CBD on December 21, 2016 in Brisbane, Australia. (Photo by Glenn Hunt/Fairfax Media)
Brisbane has an established rapid transit bus network. Photo: Glenn Hunt

He said Victoria had only made half-hearted attempts at bus priority and it was time to get serious.

"People have a negative view of buses because they are in mixed traffic, because they are infrequent, unreliable – you don't have to run buses that way at all," he said.

But he questioned the need to use the Eastern Freeway median, arguing the biggest issue for the current Doncaster bus services was congestion in the inner city.

Daniel Bowen, spokesman for the Public Transport Users Association, said the busway would be "a quantum leap over the current bus service" in terms of capacity and reliability, but would never match the capacity of heavy rail.

"Many people would still want Doncaster rail to be built," Mr Bowen said.

With a proposed capacity of 150 passengers, the buses would fit three-quarters as many passengers as an E-Class tram, the largest tram type in Melbourne.

Transdev spokeswoman Kathy Lazanas said the proposal put to Treasury last month would evolve through consultation with the community, should the Andrews government support it.

"We will work with the Victorian government through its well established market-led proposal process," Ms Lazanas said.

The guidelines state all private sector proposals put to the government must be unique.
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Re: Transdev Doncaster Busway Proposal

Postby jamesadams7 » Thu Jun 08, 2017 9:25 am

It's a good idea and something I'm aware they've been working on since at least last year.

The doors on both sides seems unnecessary, and will only increase the cost of the buses, reduce seating space and mean normal buses cannot operate on the busway. The Hoddle Street, Victoria Parade and Lonsdale Street platforms should be dual platforms with left-side boarding. The Eastern Freeway platforms can only realistically be island platforms, but instead of buses "crossing over" before the platforms which will slow their average speed, especially if express, the lanes should simply run in reverse so left-side boarding would still be possible.

Doncaster Rail campaigners and Manningham Council was briefed on this proposal and we generally intend to support it and campaign for it as a short-medium term goal with Doncaster Rail in the long term.


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Re: Transdev Doncaster Busway Proposal

Postby Alstom 888M » Thu Jun 08, 2017 12:46 pm

The busway could be designed to run the "wrong way". You'd need to set up barriers to prevent a head on though.

How would the buses leave at the various turn-offs?
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Re: Transdev Doncaster Busway Proposal

Postby Roderick Smith » Thu Jun 08, 2017 3:35 pm

I suspect that all the concepts are cheating: that width doesn't exist. Of course a busway is cheap if it takes over existing roads. However, the useless IV/PTV price for a railway just has to be overstated.
Smithplan looked at reviving the original concept: Clifton Hill loop to Victoria Park, with four stations thinned to two (West Richmond & North Richmond replaced with an intermediate; Collingwood & Victoria Park replaced with an intermediate). Then median with stops at Chandler Hwy and Bulleen Rd, and a terminus at Doncaster Park'n'ride (so no tunnel). That would require a proper bus interchange, of a style which Victoria has never had, but with two or three in Perth. I experienced the style for the first time, when the metro didn't extend to Tuen Mun. Buses on a deck just above the train, at right angles, with direct access from every bus platform to every train platform.

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Re: Transdev Doncaster Busway Proposal

Postby MAN 16.242 » Thu Jun 08, 2017 5:39 pm

http://www.smh.com.au/victoria/apartmen ... wn2f8.html

Apartments may be built over Eastern Freeway with Doncaster rapid busway

Apartment towers could soar above the Eastern Freeway one day, with easy access to Melbourne's first high-capacity "busway" below.

French-based transport company Transdev wants to build and operate Melbourne's first rapid transit bus system, between Doncaster and the CBD, and has proposed selling property developers the "air rights" to build above the freeway to help pay for it.



Two sites – the freeway interchange at Chandler Highway in Kew, and the park and ride facility in Doncaster – have been identified by Transdev as opportunities for future "transit-oriented development" if the busway goes ahead.

This would involve building directly above 10 lanes of traffic on the Eastern Freeway in Kew.


A Transdev bus in Lonsdale Street, which could form part of Melbourne's first rapid transit busway.
Doncaster to CBD: Special busway may run down middle of Hoddle Street
Building above a freeway has not been attempted in Melbourne, but has been done successfully in overseas cities, including Boston and New York in the US and Osaka in Japan.

The proposal is that residential towers, with a mix of office and retail space, would extend up to eight storeys high from platforms constructed on either side of the Chandler Highway overpass.

The platforms would also include multi-level car parking, public art, and escalators and lifts down to the ground-level bus platforms in the freeway median.


Eight-storey structures could also be built over the Doncaster park-and-ride facility at the intersection of the Eastern Freeway and Doncaster Road. The buildings would house shops at ground level and apartments above.

The current ground-level car park would be expanded into a multi-level facility, according to Transdev's proposal, which was developed with engineering consultancy AECOM.

The company wants to build and operate the busway for 30 years, and has offered to pay the estimated $500 million-plus capital cost up front in a public-private partnership with the Andrews government.

High-capacity buses would run every three minutes in the peak between Donvale Hospital and Southern Cross Station. Other vehicles such as cars and trucks would be banned from the bus lanes.



According to a proposal Transdev submitted to the Department of Treasury late last month, the busway would be used by 24,000 passengers in the peak each day, and would provide the city of Manningham with a speedier and more reliable journey to and from the city than current bus services.

The Eastern Freeway median – long set aside for a potential future Doncaster railway line – would instead become an express busway.

Transdev issued a statement on Thursday after The Age revealed its bold pitch, which is at the first stage of the government's market-led proposals process.

"The Doncaster Bus Rapid Transit project is a proposal only at this stage," the company said.

"Elements of the proposal would evolve through extensive engagement with the community and other stakeholders should the Victorian government support the further development of the proposal."

It is understood the company's busway proposal does not hinge on selling air rights above the freeway.

The idea of building along the bus corridor could be explored at a future stage of its operation, should the government go ahead with the proposal.

Transit-oriented developments are already a growing feature of Melbourne's railways.

The government proposes to build a 13-storey mixed-use building above Ormond station, which was rebuilt as part of the North Road level crossing removal.

And government corporation VicTrack has already partnered with the property industry on several developments on underused railway land, at stations including Glen Waverley, Jewell in Brunswick, Hampton and Windsor.

Carolyn Whitzmann, Professor in Urban Planning at the University of Melbourne, said transit-oriented development could work just as well above freeways and busways as railways.

The key was the quality of the design and its social benefit in terms of providing good housing and improved transport.

"The main determinant will be the benefit to local residents and residents of Melbourne," Professor Whitzmann said.

"Will there be affordable housing, housing for older people, and families with a limited interest in owning cars?"

The Andrews government was contacted but said it could not comment on a proposal that is at stage one of its market-led proposals process.
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Re: Transdev Doncaster Busway Proposal

Postby tonyp » Fri Jun 09, 2017 8:07 am

As Daniel said, the main issue is capacity and it's really a planning decision as to what mode is required considering the population of the catchment and future growth projections. In the end, bus is the lowest capacity mode, no matter how much you try to squeeze out of it.

The other thing is that double-articulated buses are unlikely to be ever allowed on public roads in Australia due to axle load issues, which leaves you with restricting them to an exclusive ROW requiring interchange with feeder buses, like the present proposal for the Brisbane busways and like the way Gold Coast light rail works. I suspect Transdev is already onto this as they quote the capacity of a bus as 150 which is the capacity of a single-articulated bus in Europe (the Mercedes Benz Capacity single-articulated with twin rear axle is rated at 190 passengers). Double articulateds in Europe are usually rated at about 200-220 passengers. So it's lot of money to put into an extra-long bus that doesn't really have that much more capacity in Australian operation.

If the government doesn't want to consider heavy rail, I'd be looking at a tram line. And aren't there already bus lanes along the Doncaster freeway?
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Re: Transdev Doncaster Busway Proposal

Postby MAN 16.242 » Fri Jun 09, 2017 8:49 am

tonyp wrote: If the government doesn't want to consider heavy rail, I'd be looking at a tram line. And aren't there already bus lanes along the Doncaster freeway?

In peak time buses can use the emergency lane on the freeway. Also in peak times Lonsdale St, Hoddle St(Southbound, Doncaster Rd and High St, Doncaster(Southbound) have bus lanes. Plus Victoria St and Victoria Pde have 24/7 bus lanes.

While current bus priority is not perfect it is miles ahead of many of Transdev other city routes. The current priority DART has means they dont suffer some of really major delays other Transdev routes face. So these are not most delayed prone routes though better bus priority is always welcome especially given number buses that use the corrdior.
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Re: Transdev Doncaster Busway Proposal

Postby Craig » Fri Jun 09, 2017 11:49 am

Although buses can use the emergency lane, at each exit the bus has to negotiate the traffic coming on and off each of the ramps - Chandler Hwy exit a prime example.

Having the bus lane in the centre of the freeway on the other hand would allow the bus an uninterrupted run.

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Re: Transdev Doncaster Busway Proposal

Postby Roderick Smith » Fri Jun 09, 2017 12:45 pm

The problem with a tram is getting a fast exit from the city. I looked at 96 to Alexandra Pde, then east. It still needs an interchange to serve the catchment.
The busway gets its fast exit by swallowing existing roads.
Heavy rail could have a fast exit, but PTV is incapable of planning it. It too would need a major interchange, and PTV is incapable of designing one.

Roderick

June 8 2017 Apartments may be built over Eastern Freeway with Doncaster rapid busway.
Apartment towers could soar above the Eastern Freeway one day, with easy access to Melbourne's first high-capacity "busway" below.
French-based transport company Transdev wants to build and operate Melbourne's first rapid transit bus system, between Doncaster and the CBD, and has proposed selling property developers the "air rights" to build above the freeway to help pay for it.
The Gate Tower building in Osaka, Japan.
Two sites – the freeway interchange at Chandler Highway in Kew, and the park and ride facility in Doncaster – have been identified by Transdev as opportunities for future "transit-oriented development" if the busway goes ahead.
This would involve building directly above 10 lanes of traffic on the Eastern Freeway in Kew.
Building above a freeway has not been attempted in Melbourne, but has been done successfully in overseas cities, including Boston and New York in the US and Osaka in Japan.
The proposal is that residential towers, with a mix of office and retail space, would extend up to eight storeys high from platforms constructed on either side of the Chandler Highway overpass.
The platforms would also include multi-level car parking, public art, and escalators and lifts down to the ground-level bus platforms in the freeway median.
graphic
Eight-storey structures could also be built over the Doncaster park-and-ride facility at the intersection of the Eastern Freeway and Doncaster Road. The buildings would house shops at ground level and apartments above.
The current ground-level car park would be expanded into a multi-level facility, according to Transdev's proposal, which was developed with engineering consultancy AECOM.
The company wants to build and operate the busway for 30 years, and has offered to pay the estimated $500 million-plus capital cost up front in a public-private partnership with the Andrews government.
High-capacity buses would run every three minutes in the peak between Donvale Hospital and Southern Cross Station. Other vehicles such as cars and trucks would be banned from the bus lanes.
graphic
According to a proposal Transdev submitted to the Department of Treasury late last month, the busway would be used by 24,000 passengers in the peak each day, and would provide the city of Manningham with a speedier and more reliable journey to and from the city than current bus services.
The Eastern Freeway median – long set aside for a potential future Doncaster railway line – would instead become an express busway.
Transdev issued a statement on Thursday after The Age revealed its bold pitch, which is at the first stage of the government's market-led proposals process.
"The Doncaster Bus Rapid Transit project is a proposal only at this stage," the company said.
"Elements of the proposal would evolve through extensive engagement with the community and other stakeholders should the Victorian government support the further development of the proposal."
It is understood the company's busway proposal does not hinge on selling air rights above the freeway.
The idea of building along the bus corridor could be explored at a future stage of its operation, should the government go ahead with the proposal.
Transit-oriented developments are already a growing feature of Melbourne's railways.
The government proposes to build a 13-storey mixed-use building above Ormond station, which was rebuilt as part of the North Road level crossing removal.
And government corporation VicTrack has already partnered with the property industry on several developments on underused railway land, at stations including Glen Waverley, Jewell in Brunswick, Hampton and Windsor.
Carolyn Whitzmann, Professor in Urban Planning at the University of Melbourne, said transit-oriented development could work just as well above freeways and busways as railways.
The key was the quality of the design and its social benefit in terms of providing good housing and improved transport.
"The main determinant will be the benefit to local residents and residents of Melbourne," Professor Whitzmann said.
"Will there be affordable housing, housing for older people, and families with a limited interest in owning cars?"
The Andrews government was contacted but said it could not comment on a proposal that is at stage one of its market-led proposals process.
Related Content:
A Transdev bus in Lonsdale Street, which could form part of Melbourne's first rapid transit busway.
Doncaster to CBD: Special busway may run down middle of Hoddle Street .
Construction work at Ormond railway station.
High-rises plans for suburban stations to help fund level crossing removals .
http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/apart ... wn2f8.html
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Re: Transdev Doncaster Busway Proposal

Postby Heihachi_73 » Sat Jun 24, 2017 9:10 pm

How is a central bus stop platform going to be of any use when bus doors open on the left in this country? Hoddle St should have had trams going up and down it ever since the road was first opened, it's ridiculous that they had trams in what was the bush in the late 1800s (Box Hill to Doncaster) but not the city.
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Re: Transdev Doncaster Busway Proposal

Postby Bus Suggestions » Sat Jun 24, 2017 9:51 pm

Heihachi_73 wrote:How is a central bus stop platform going to be of any use when bus doors open on the left in this country?

I thought there was something in there about doors on both sides...
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Re: Transdev Doncaster Busway Proposal

Postby paulgersche » Sat Jun 24, 2017 10:07 pm

Bus Suggestions wrote:I thought there was something in there about doors on both sides...
TIP: READ BEFORE POSTING!
MAN 16.242 wrote:http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/bid-to-pave-over-doncaster-rail-reserve-for-melbournes-first-rapid-busway-20170601-gwie1z.html

Doncaster to CBD: Special busway may run down middle of Hoddle Street
Advertisement

Adam Carey
53 mins ago


The plan for Melbourne's first rapid busway
Melbourne's first ever designated busway may run down the middle of Hoddle Street with bumper-sized bendy buses running every three minutes between East Doncaster and Southern Cross Station.

Global transport giant Transdev has pitched to the Andrews government a proposal to build and operate the "Doncaster bus rapid transit" system for 30 years and reinvent public transport in Melbourne's eastern suburbs.


The French-based company, which has a contract to operate a third of Melbourne's bus network, wants to build and run the premium bus service as a public-private partnership.

The rapid transit busway would be a first for Melbourne, but would mirror international examples Transdev operates in cities such as Nantes in France and Bogota in Colombia.

Senior ministers have been briefed on the proposal, including Treasurer Tim Pallas and Public Transport Minister Jacinta Allan.

Transdev and infrastructure developer John Laing submitted the idea late last month, using the Department of Treasury's market-led proposal guidelines – the same process Transurban used to gain approval for its West Gate Tunnel project.


It is estimated the Doncaster-CBD busway would cost more than $500 million to build, which is 10 to 16 per cent of the estimated $3 billion - $5 billion cost of building Doncaster rail, a project Infrastructure Victoria assessed last year would return just 10 cents for every dollar spent.

Transdev wants to pave over the Eastern Freeway median – which has been reserved for almost 50 years for a future Doncaster railway line – for express buses instead of trains.


The buses would be double-articulated, with doors on both sides like trains and trams, and big enough to fit up to 150 passengers. They would run every three minutes in the peak and every five to six minutes off-peak.

Platform bus stops would have myki readers so buses would not be delayed while passengers touch on and off.

New bus "stations" would potentially be built at intersections above the Eastern Freeway, at Chandler Highway, Burke Road and Bulleen Road. This would involve building platforms over the freeway, with escalators and lifts down to road level.


From the Eastern Freeway the busway would join Hoddle Street via a dedicated ramp, then potentially follow Victoria Parade and Lonsdale Street to a new underground bus terminus at the northern end of Southern Cross Station.

If the busway followed Lonsdale Street, the trees and on-street car parks in the median would be replaced by bus lanes and platform stops.

Express bus lanes would also be built in the centre of Doncaster Road, running from the current park and ride bus terminus, which would be expanded with a new underground car park, to a new bus terminus at Donvale Hospital.


Other vehicles such as cars and trucks would be strictly banned from the busway.

Modelling by engineering consultancy AECOM found the bus rapid transit system would provide a reliable 30-minute journey between Doncaster and Southern Cross station.

Currently that journey takes 47 minutes or more in the peak due to inner-city traffic jams.

AECOM forecast the service would be used by 24,000 people in the combined morning and afternoon peaks, roughly eight times more than use the current Doncaster bus routes to the city.

Transdev argues its busway would be more like a railway, with superior travel speeds and service consistency, than a conventional bus route.

The busway would not preclude future construction of Doncaster rail in the freeway median.

The concept has already won the support of the Eastern Transport Coalition, a group of seven eastern suburbs councils pushing for better transport in Melbourne's east.

The Coalition said traffic congestion on Hoddle Street, Lonsdale Street and at the end of the Eastern Freeway "compromises travel time" for Doncaster buses, which are the only public transport between Manningham and the city.

It endorsed a bus rapid transit system in its Commuters Count campaign, launched this week.

Monash University's Professor Graham Currie helped to design Melbourne's current SmartBus network and said many cities had chosen bus rapid transit systems as an effective and less expensive alternative to rail.

"It's a rubber-tyred railway, the new technology dominating public transport thinking on planet Earth," he said of the concept.

BRISBANE, AUSTRALIA - DECEMBER 21: wrap around bus advertising in Brisbane's CBD on December 21, 2016 in Brisbane, Australia. (Photo by Glenn Hunt/Fairfax Media)
Brisbane has an established rapid transit bus network. Photo: Glenn Hunt

He said Victoria had only made half-hearted attempts at bus priority and it was time to get serious.

"People have a negative view of buses because they are in mixed traffic, because they are infrequent, unreliable – you don't have to run buses that way at all," he said.

But he questioned the need to use the Eastern Freeway median, arguing the biggest issue for the current Doncaster bus services was congestion in the inner city.

Daniel Bowen, spokesman for the Public Transport Users Association, said the busway would be "a quantum leap over the current bus service" in terms of capacity and reliability, but would never match the capacity of heavy rail.

"Many people would still want Doncaster rail to be built," Mr Bowen said.

With a proposed capacity of 150 passengers, the buses would fit three-quarters as many passengers as an E-Class tram, the largest tram type in Melbourne.

Transdev spokeswoman Kathy Lazanas said the proposal put to Treasury last month would evolve through consultation with the community, should the Andrews government support it.

"We will work with the Victorian government through its well established market-led proposal process," Ms Lazanas said.

The guidelines state all private sector proposals put to the government must be unique.


There was - in the original quoted article (I have highlighted the section for you!

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Re: Transdev Doncaster Busway Proposal

Postby Heihachi_73 » Sun Jun 25, 2017 8:26 am

So there was, hidden somewhere in that 1000 word article which I had TLDR-ified! There's still no point in having these huge things going up and down Hoddle St, considering they still have to go through traffic either end of the busway. Doncaster is probably too short of a distance these days to even be considered for heavy rail, maybe in 1930 when the Glen Waverley line was built and then left to rot by the idiots who decided to dump houses and shops right in front of the terminus. Light rail from Doncaster to the city, down the middle of both the Eastern Freeway and Hoddle St. Maybe even all the way down and underneath Richmond station instead of turning at Victoria St.
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Re: Transdev Doncaster Busway Proposal

Postby MAN 16.242 » Sun Jun 25, 2017 9:14 pm

Heihachi_73 wrote:There's still no point in having these huge things going up and down Hoddle St, considering they still have to go through traffic either end of the busway. .
As stated in the article there be bus priorty along centre of road along off Lonsdale St and Doncaster Rd so this aviods lot of the stuck in traffic issues. And even if they didnt some bus priorty is better than none.
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Re: Transdev Doncaster Busway Proposal

Postby MCI9 » Mon Jun 26, 2017 8:56 am

o bahn is the way to go Adelaide it works here it would in so many places
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Re: Transdev Doncaster Busway Proposal

Postby tonyp » Mon Jun 26, 2017 9:18 am

MCI9 wrote:o bahn is the way to go Adelaide it works here it would in so many places

The Doncaster route doesn't need O Bahn technology, there is space for bus lanes along a motorway. The Adelaide O Bahn has a special minimised track through parklands and needs the guided technology. O Bahn has application only in very limited circumstances and in fact its takeup around the world has been almost non-existent considering how long it's been available - only about half a dozen cities afaik. The last thing you need is another costly layer of technology on top if it's not necessary.
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Re: Transdev Doncaster Busway Proposal

Postby nonscenic » Tue Aug 22, 2017 9:33 pm

One bottleneck with this proposal will be congestion at the Doncaster Park and Ride, which is already a sad joke in weekday peak times. Even if separate car and bus entries were built, and expensive works added to separate none bus station traffic from buses and cars using the facility, the congestion at what is already a complex intersection would hinder everyone's progress.
There is also no mention of what would happen with the 906 bus route that starts at the unofficial Park and Ride at the Pines shopping centre and enters the freeway at Blackburn Road. Similarly for the 905 and 908 routes that would seemingly have to remain as they do now. Otherwise non articulated buses with doors on both sides would have to be used and special access and exit ramps built along the freeway to enable them to use the new lanes.
After 33 years of commuting by bus, I now have a Seniors Myki and two more hours a day not stuck in Victoria parade on a Transdev bus.
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Re: Transdev Doncaster Busway Proposal

Postby Dennis Dart » Sat Sep 30, 2017 9:14 am

One benefit of this rejection is that Transdev won't be locked into an extension of its contract which was probably the main reason they put forward this proposal.

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http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/red-light-for-transdevs-rapid-busway-between-doncaster-and-cbd-20170929-gyrds6.html

Red light for Transdev's rapid busway between Doncaster and CBD
Adam Carey


Everyone agrees the end of the Eastern Freeway is the worst pinch point on Melbourne's freeways, but nobody can agree on how to fix it.

The Liberals argue that only the East West Link will unblock the traffic bottleneck; the Greens want Doncaster rail; and Labor says upgrading four intersections along Hoddle Street and Punt Road will ease the problem.


Now the Andrews government – which cancelled the East West Link contract when it came to power – has killed off another proposed solution.

In May, public transport company Transdev pitched a plan to build and operate Melbourne's first "bus rapid transit" system – a dedicated, high-speed busway between Doncaster and Southern Cross Station.


The system promised to revolutionise commuting in Melbourne's public transport-poor north-east, but this week Labor said no.

The concept was a unique one for Melbourne: double-articulated bendy buses running every three minutes between Doncaster Hill in Manningham – the only Melbourne municipality without a rail line – and Southern Cross Station.

It would have turned the Eastern Freeway median, which has been reserved for 50 years for a future Doncaster rail link, into a busway and put bus lanes and bus "stations" in the middle of Hoddle Street and Lonsdale Street.
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It would have replaced the DART bus services that run between the CBD and Manningham with a service that could handle roughly eight times as many passengers in the peak and cut bus travel times by about 17 minutes.
graphic

Transdev spokeswoman Kathy Lazanas said the company was disappointed with the government's knockback, but would continue to look for opportunities to work with it to improve public transport in Melbourne.

"We firmly believe new solutions like bus rapid transit, or 'rubber-tyred railways' as they were described by one commentator recently, are cost effective and attractive and will be a part of the future transport mix in a number of our cities," Ms Lazanas said.

The busway would have cost an estimated $500 million to build, a fraction of Doncaster rail's $3 billion to $5 billion price tag.

The French-based company and its financing partner, John Laing, had offered to pay the development cost in exchange for the right to run the service for 30 years.

The Victorian Greens, who were also briefed on the proposal, said the government's rejection of bus rapid transit meant there was still no end in sight to Eastern Freeway gridlock.

"The government continues to ignore the community in Manningham," Eastern Metropolitan upper house MP Samantha Dunn said.

"Dan Andrews doesn't care about commuters that are crawling at 9 km/h speeds on the Eastern Freeway."

VicRoads data shows the city-bound end of the Eastern Freeway is Melbourne's worst freeway choke point, with average traffic speeds of 9 km/h in the morning peak and 18 km/h in the evening peak.

Transdev submitted its rapid busway proposal through the government's market-led proposals guidelines, by which the private sector can put forward its own ideas for infrastructure projects.

Submissions are assessed by the Department of Treasury and Finance in a five-stage process, and only those proposals that get past stage two are publicly revealed. The busway was rejected at stage two.

A spokesman for Treasurer Tim Pallas declined to explain why it did not proceed, saying it was "not appropriate to comment".

The Coalition said the Andrews government looked increasingly hostile to infrastructure proposals that came from the private sector instead of the bureaucracy.

"It appears Daniel Andrews and his government are increasingly determined to reject all market-led proposals, unless they come from Transurban," Liberal public transport spokesman David Davis said.

The planned $5.5 billion West Gate Tunnel was successfully submitted to Labor by Transurban, which will get a 10 to 12-year extension on CityLink tolls in exchange for building it.

It also previously negotiated a one-year extension of its CityLink concession deed with the former Napthine government in an $850 million deal to widen the Tullamarine Freeway.

But some public transport proposals have fared less well in the process.

The Andrews government has rejected a proposal from Metro to upgrade the Cranbourne-Pakenham rail corridor, and one by a construction company to build three multi-level car parks at outer suburban railway stations.
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Re: Transdev Doncaster Busway Proposal

Postby crakening » Sat Sep 30, 2017 1:46 pm

Lucky this didn't go ahead - imagine 100 passengers being stuck in driving rain in the Eastern Freeway median after their dirty, late Transdev bus breaks down. They'd have to walk home as all the other Transdev buses have been defected.

Hopefully the government will actually investigate this kind of idea - a busway can provide a reasonable and affordable solution for Doncaster services. One would hope the intersection upgrades on Hoddle St have some element of bus priority.
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Re: Transdev Doncaster Busway Proposal

Postby boronia » Sat Sep 30, 2017 4:42 pm

Bus Suggestions wrote:
Heihachi_73 wrote:How is a central bus stop platform going to be of any use when bus doors open on the left in this country?

I thought there was something in there about doors on both sides...
TIP: READ BEFORE POSTING!

Doors on both sides take up passenger space. Sydney has some central platform bus stops, where the buses simply change sides when approaching and leaving the stops. Been like this for 20+ years, I'm not aware of any problems with it.
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Re: Transdev Doncaster Busway Proposal

Postby nonscenic » Sat Sep 30, 2017 4:51 pm

Doncaster and surrounds needs to become much more marginal electorates for any proposal on public transport to get the go ahead. I don't think any proposal will succeed until there is a need to kick start the Doncaster Hill project and it is realised that people aren't moving into the precinct because of the lack of public transport and the grid lock of traffic around Doncaster Shoppingtown. With existing bus services the Eastern Freeway isn't the major source of delays, rather it is the run along Lonsdale St, Victoria Parade and Hoddle Street, plus the hopeless Park and Ride and Shoppingtown circumnavigation that is slowing down bus services. Many commuters are currently parking their cars on side streets along Doncaster Rd, High Street and Thompsons Rd or are using The Pines Shopping Centre as a second Park and Ride. For those not directly catching the red lighted rapid busway directly any time savings would have been negated by connections at the already over congested Park and Ride.
After 33 years of commuting by bus, I now have a Seniors Myki and two more hours a day not stuck in Victoria parade on a Transdev bus.
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Re: Transdev Doncaster Busway Proposal

Postby krustyklo » Sat Sep 30, 2017 10:42 pm

One benefit of this rejection is that Transdev won't be locked into an extension of its contract which was probably the main reason they put forward this proposal.

It would be interesting to know when the decision was made. Likely before the current debacle, but still...

Hopefully the government will actually investigate this kind of idea - a busway can provide a reasonable and affordable solution for Doncaster services.

What's stopping the current 907 from running every 3-4 minutes now? Given the busway proposal was pretty much a shortened 907 with longer buses (double articulated) every 3-4 minutes, I can't see how providing more services on the current route isn't more affordable than a fancy busway using captive technology. Looking at the current timetable, the best the frequency gets is every 6-8 minutes in the direction of the peak flow, so there seems to be scope for improvement before the need arises. Even then, given the room in the median, why not a normal set of bus lanes? Is there really any need for stops in the freeway reservation - this would be a significant expense I would have thought? Chandler Hwy is in the middle of nowhere and has no connecting bus services worth mentioning (a few 609s doesn't really count). Burke Rd has an OK connecting bus service and some catchment either side, but there's also a large park within that catchment which would be less attractive for providing a 3-4 minute service to given there's the tram down the road, or bus to Ivanhoe and train. Bulleen Rd would have some justification for connecting to existing services leaving the freeway or the 200.

As noted above, I also suspect that it was a ploy to do a Transurban and provide some infrastructure in return for a franchise extension and the right to sell the air rights above the freeway interchanges. Thankfully it has been rejected...

I don't think any proposal will succeed until there is a need to kick start the Doncaster Hill project and it is realised that people aren't moving into the precinct because of the lack of public transport and the grid lock of traffic around Doncaster Shoppingtown.

Um, if it's the same Doncaster Hill project the council have been spruiking, it has well and truly kickstarted. In fact, the map on the Doncaster Hill website notes a number of buildings have been completed. A quick look around Doncaster Junction would indicate this is factually correct, with other buildings currently being erected such as The Nest project.

As for the lack of public transport, it is a 4 minute walk from the junction to the Shoppingtown interchange. I am still not quite sure why everyone keeps talking about the "terrible public transport" when on weekdays every major road has a 15 minute or better bus service, with mostly half hourly frequencies on weekends or better on the same routes. Sure, Transdev buses are filthy and unreliable, but given other operators seem to be able to run clean, somewhat reliable services this is not a given. Stand at Shoppingtown sometime and tell me how few bus services there are. Every cycle of lights at the entrance often has between 1 and 3 buses enter the interchange in peak hour from either north or south. I can only assume that any area without some sort of rail transport is deemed impoverished when in fact most of Manningham has more frequent buses during the day than half of Melbourne's rail lines on weekdays. The main time it is worse is on weekends, and increasing bus frequencies on weekends has an easier solution than building a $5 billion rail line or still expensive busway on a single, albeit busy, route.

With existing bus services the Eastern Freeway isn't the major source of delays, rather it is the run along Lonsdale St, Victoria Parade and Hoddle Street, plus the hopeless Park and Ride and Shoppingtown circumnavigation that is slowing down bus services.

Completely agreed. Let's deal with that problem than using a sledgehammer such as a busway. 24/7 bus lanes should be technically possible, if politically tricky. However, the busway would have the same problem. As for the circumnavigation, the 907 doesn't go into Shoppingtown so that problem is already solved without anything being built at all. A bus stop out the front of the Park and Ride on Doncaster Rd for the 907 would fix that problem. Whilst we're at it, do the same thing at Shoppingtown for southbound 902 and 903 services by putting a bus stop opposite the current interchange on Manningham Rd. Should easily cut 3-5 minutes off each trip not going into Shoppingtown, getting stuck behind the work utes doing up the new restaurants, the armed money vans parked in the interchange, the buses in the stops next to them, etc; then waiting for the lights in the exit road from the car park to trigger to let the bus out, then the lights on Manningham Rd to let everyone out. I'm sure most users would happily accept the 30 second walk from the existing stop to avoid the longer exit.
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Re: Transdev Doncaster Busway

Postby Roderick Smith » Mon Nov 27, 2017 2:20 pm

171126Su-Melbourne'HeraldSun'-Doncaster.busway.jpg
Roderick
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