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New bus network arising from SMNW opening

Sydney / New South Wales Transport Discussion

Re: New bus network arising from SMNW opening

Postby Geo101 » Tue Sep 17, 2019 6:11 am

tonyp wrote:. Time for some new talent perhaps?


What I think it is time to do is to attach some sort of smart number plate to all vehicles. Find out where they are all coming from and going to, and when.

Companies like Google and Uber already do this by using phone user data. Not sure I’d be happy with the Government going down the same path, but I’d certainly like to see them implement some sort of vehicle tracking with the objective of improving road and public transport planning.
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Re: New bus network arising from SMNW opening

Postby tonyp » Tue Sep 17, 2019 7:00 am

I think a desire to get to the nearest railway station is as strong as it has ever been. It doesn't take much to figure that out.

It's funny to think back to the time when the metro opponents were arguing that there was a conspiracy to make the metro look good and Sydney Trains look bad. Well now that it's up and running, a scroll through the journey planner suggests that it's metro advocates who should be paranoid - it looks like TfNSW is jumping through hoops to prevent people boarding the metro! Searching the journey planner for morning peak trips from north Cherrybrook to the city, every successive local feeder bus goes in a different direction (I found this in reverse searching trips from the metro in norwest to Norwest hospital too). There is no constant predictable bus service that just goes to the nearest railway station - Cherrybrook. The north Cherrybrook buses mostly feed down to the capacity-constrained express buses on the M2, some go in the wrong direction to Castle Hill station, some go to Pennant Hills station, trashing the prospect of a fast trip to the city. I've never seen anything like it. Why can't they just do a frequent, predictable bus down to Cherrybrook station?

Looking through the public feedback on the metro over time, it seems to me that the strongest theme coming through is: I love it but I can't get to it. The carparks are full by 7 and the (ahem) "feeder" buses go everywhere except the nearest station.
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Re: New bus network arising from SMNW opening

Postby burrumbus » Tue Sep 17, 2019 2:51 pm

Cherrybrook is the worst case in the NW bus network where literally nothing is available from the nearby residential areas to the Cherrybrook Station.
Most of the other stations suffer from simllar situations but there is generally a 30 minute peak/60 minute convoluted route covering some of the nearby areas into the stations.
Most of us on this forum know that sort of frequency and route coverage does not cut the mustard and will not attract good patronage.
Makes you wonder what sort of thinking(or the lack of)was going on in TFNSW and to an extent Hillsbus??
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Re: New bus network arising from SMNW opening

Postby tonyp » Tue Sep 17, 2019 4:02 pm

Perth - a city with 40% of Sydney's population - typically no worse than 15 minute headway feeder services to stations, often closer than that, in peak; no worse than 30 minutes off peak. This mess stymies the effectiveness of the metro. Is any part of the suburban network fed as badly as this I wonder?
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Re: New bus network arising from SMNW opening

Postby moa999 » Tue Sep 17, 2019 4:22 pm

I'm sure there are areas of Perth with equally bad bus services as parts of Sydney.
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Re: New bus network arising from SMNW opening

Postby Merc1107 » Tue Sep 17, 2019 5:54 pm

moa999 wrote:I'm sure there are areas of Perth with equally bad bus services as parts of Sydney.
There are plenty of feeders at only hourly headways during the day, but particularly at night and on weekends (bearing in mind nearer the interchanges there is usually reasonable combined frequency, but that's not really the same). This isn't necessarily limited to outer suburbs, either.
More recently there have been efforts to improve this, but it's far from 30min minimum all the time, everywhere.
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Re: New bus network arising from SMNW opening

Postby tonyp » Tue Sep 17, 2019 6:35 pm

But peak services are usually pretty good, which is the times of day when it's more critical to most users. The point is that the metro has over three times the patronage of say the Joondalup line, which suggests there's probably three times the population around it, which in turn suggests that the feeder bus services in Sydney should be three times better than those in Perth, not worse!

Look at that route from Windsor to Rouse Hill - weekdays only, hourly in peak and two hourly off peak! That would be an excellent service to address the parking problem at Tallawong with its catchment stretching to the mountains. A 15 minute service on that route would encourage people to park further out and use the bus to get to the metro. It's as though the planners completely failed to predict the reach of the metro and exploit the opportunities for people to access it.
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Re: New bus network arising from SMNW opening

Postby Tram Fan 24/7 » Fri Sep 20, 2019 11:59 pm

I had the chance to ride the Metro recently to Tallawong & hoped to find a bus to take me to Schofields. While there a little blue on demand shuttle bus arrived, dropped off some pax & went on it's way.
I looked for a manufacturers name or model name but didn't see one.
Does anyone know who makes these little blue buses?

My pic is too big for this post :(

Any Ideas?

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Re: New bus network arising from SMNW opening

Postby Daniel » Sat Sep 21, 2019 5:48 am

Hino Poncho.
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Re: New bus network arising from SMNW opening

Postby tonyp » Sat Sep 21, 2019 6:05 am

Tram Fan 24/7 wrote:I had the chance to ride the Metro recently to Tallawong & hoped to find a bus to take me to Schofields. While there a little blue on demand shuttle bus arrived, dropped off some pax & went on it's way.
I looked for a manufacturers name or model name but didn't see one.
Does anyone know who makes these little blue buses?

My pic is too big for this post :(

Any Ideas?

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That's Cooee Busways according to Transport Info but its website won't open for me. It connects The Ponds, Schofields and Kellyville Ridge to Tallawong and Rouse Hill stations. The way things are, they should extend its catchment to the lower Blue Mountains!

So how did you go getting a connection to Schofields? There are supposed to be a couple of direct bus routes (732 and 751 I think) but the Journey Planner in its usual fashion shows options all over the shop. You can have journey times ranging from 8 minutes to 40 minutes, depending on how long you like riding a bus for while transiting a 4 km gap. For bus enthusiasts, I recommend the 40 minute service.
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Re: New bus network arising from SMNW opening

Postby Tram Fan 24/7 » Sun Sep 22, 2019 10:49 pm

Thanks to Daniel for answering my query about the Hino Poncho on demand bus I saw out at Tallawong Metro station recently.
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Re: New bus network arising from SMNW opening

Postby Tram Fan 24/7 » Sun Sep 22, 2019 10:57 pm

Hi Tony P, I didn't catch a bus to Schofields after all. The Wife was getting a bit cross & by my calculations the next bus was 30 mins away, so we hopped back on the Metro & rode to Rouse Hill where we took the bus to Parra.
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Re: New bus network arising from SMNW opening

Postby Richard290 » Fri Oct 04, 2019 6:58 pm

I’ve been observing a number of departures of the route 651 which often departs Epping for Rouse Hill carrying fresh air, even in peak periods.

It seems that the redirection of its route to terminate in congestion-ravaged Epping from its previous terminus at Macquarie Park, and the route’s shadowing the path of the Metro has not improved its unpopularity among passengers any better, since you can travel two stations north to Beecroft and change to the same route, minus the extra patronage from the passing Intercity and Metro services that Epping possesses.

Even though I question the retention of the 651’s route along Beecroft Road between Beecroft and Epping (paralleling the Northern Line in its midst) the only possible reason to justify that portion of the route is to serve Cheltenham Girls High School to connect students who live in WPH Valley where the route 651 deviates reasonably far away from the Metro, especially areas distant from Cherrybrook station.
In addition, with route 633 being rerouted away from Highs Road and Coonara Avenue to run direct via Castle Hill Road and Cherrybrook Station and the limitations of Route 635 running solely on weekdays, Coonara Avenue lost its weekend services (only Saturday 633 services) and lost its direct connection to Pennant Hills Station at the expense of a redirected Route 635 which now runs weekdays only on a different convoluted route through Cherrybrook Station and the Retirement Village to Castle Hill Station.
Last edited by Richard290 on Sat Oct 05, 2019 10:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: New bus network arising from SMNW opening

Postby swtt » Sat Oct 05, 2019 12:30 am

Richard290 wrote:I’ve been observing a number of departures of the route 651 which oftendeparts Epping for Rouse Hill carrying fresh air, even in peak periods.

It seems that the redirection of its route to terminate in congestion-ravaged Epping from its previous terminus at Macquarie Park, and the route’s shadowing the path of the Metro has not improved its unpopularity among passengers any better, since you can travel two stations north to Beecroft and change to the same route, minus the extra patronage from the passing Intercity and Metro services that Epping possesses.


Yep. Congestion ravaged Epping is pretty accurate - perhaps to try to retain a "one seat trip".

Maybe to make it operationally more efficient, it should terminate at Cheltenham Station.
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Re: New bus network arising from SMNW opening

Postby tonyp » Sat Oct 05, 2019 9:59 am

I commented on a Sydney Metro self-promotion facebook post saying that the metro was fantastic but people had trouble getting to it because of poor feeder bus and carpark planning. Somewhat to my surprise, I got dozens of likes and a string of comments from locals along the lines of "well said" etc!

Houston, I think there's an issue out there. And it ain't the train.
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Re: New bus network arising from SMNW opening

Postby tonyp » Sun Oct 06, 2019 11:52 am

The first part pertinent to this thread:

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-10-06/ ... s/11576000
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