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NSW Railway Observations 2019

Sydney / New South Wales Transport Discussion

Re: NSW Railway Observations 2019

Postby idontknow556 » Mon Jul 15, 2019 12:04 am

How will the S set get to the North Sydney car sidings since I've noticed that there's trackwork between North Sydney and Gordon on the same weekend as the S set farewell
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Re: NSW Railway Observations 2019

Postby Swift » Mon Jul 15, 2019 8:44 am

boronia wrote:
Linto63 wrote:I doubt Beclawat would have any of the equipment necessary to manufacture a window out of production for decades.

They are made up from shaped aluminium extrusions. They still advertise similar products.

At least with the Comeng S sets, they may be able to retrieve some upper front panels from converted driving cars to replace the ones butchered for thosee tacked on flip dot desto boxes. I hope they get some off cars awaiting scrap before it's too late.
Ideally, a set will be restored inside and out to original and one kept as it left revenue service.
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Re: NSW Railway Observations 2019

Postby Linto63 » Mon Jul 15, 2019 9:47 am

boronia wrote:They are made up from shaped aluminium extrusions. They still advertise similar products.
Bit like Toyota, sure they still make cars, but ask them to make a part for your 1982 Corolla, and they will say not interested. The tooling up costs for such a small run would be prohibitive, and it would probably only be for the static exhibits, 'elf and safety probably wouldn't allow them on the main line.
idontknow556 wrote:How will the S set get to the North Sydney car sidings since I've noticed that there's trackwork between North Sydney and Gordon on the same weekend as the S set farewell
Replacement bus services may be operating between North Sydney and Gordon, but doesn't necessarily mean work is occurring on the whole line, work in recent possessions has been concentrated on Chatswood and realigning the up track to accomodate the Metro.
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Re: NSW Railway Observations 2019

Postby Scott4570 » Mon Jul 15, 2019 12:38 pm

idontknow556 wrote:How will the S set get to the North Sydney car sidings since I've noticed that there's trackwork between North Sydney and Gordon on the same weekend as the S set farewell

Track Possession is Waverton to Gordon, clear of points leading to/from Waverton Shunting Neck and access to North Sydney Car Sidings.
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Re: NSW Railway Observations 2019

Postby boronia » Mon Jul 15, 2019 5:20 pm

Linto63 wrote:
boronia wrote:They are made up from shaped aluminium extrusions. They still advertise similar products.
Bit like Toyota, sure they still make cars, but ask them to make a part for your 1982 Corolla, and they will say not interested. The tooling up costs for such a small run would be prohibitive, and it would probably only be for the static exhibits, 'elf and safety probably wouldn't allow them on the main line.


The extrusions are most probably off the shelf commercial products, and would require only minimal tooling to shape them. Let's see what happens.
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Re: NSW Railway Observations 2019

Postby Swift » Tue Jul 16, 2019 10:52 am

boronia wrote:
The extrusions are most probably off the shelf commercial products, and would require only minimal tooling to shape them. Let's see what happens.

Yeah, kind of like putting together a Meccano set with rivets I'd imagine, once you cut and shape the extrusions.
Then cut the glass to size. Maybe some were stored away somewhere.
I don't think OH&S applies to trains for heritage or the rest couldn't be run either.
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Re: NSW Railway Observations 2019

Postby boronia » Tue Jul 16, 2019 2:02 pm

Most of the "safety concerns" are covered by having sufficient staff on board to supervise passengers and danger areas. No problems when they are all volunteers.
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Re: NSW Railway Observations 2019

Postby Linto63 » Tue Jul 16, 2019 6:41 pm

Heritage items tend to have grandfather rights, allowing them to continue operating in the same condition that they were withdrawn in without having to be upgraded to comply with more modern regulations. However they are required to be up-to-date in terms of some equipment like signalling. Heritage items are generally not able to be down-specced, i.e. have safety modifications made during their services lives reversed.

Bit like cars manufactured before seat belts became mandatory, can continue to be registered without them, but if retrofitted, they can't then be removed.
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Re: NSW Railway Observations 2019

Postby Transport Buff » Tue Jul 16, 2019 9:04 pm

I was just doing some random searching of bus routes on transportnsw.info and found this rather interesting bus route and timetable.
https://transportnsw.info/routes/detail ... il/61RAI-L
Does anyone happen to know the purpose of this beside it being a rail trackwork bus? Firstly, a bit weird to have a bus going from Woy Woy to Woy Woy and to take about 3 hours. Ditto for Gosford. Secondly, the name doesn't quite help anyone to find out where the bus goes. Hope someone may have more info...
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Re: NSW Railway Observations 2019

Postby Fleet Lists » Tue Jul 16, 2019 9:29 pm

Certainly a strange one - no stops available for it either in the dynamic map.
The 68 in https://transportnsw.info/documents/tim ... 190722.pdf is allocated to Busways Central Coast route services.
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Re: NSW Railway Observations 2019

Postby Fleet Lists » Wed Jul 17, 2019 8:55 am

It has gone this morning.
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Re: NSW Railway Observations 2019

Postby matthewg » Wed Jul 17, 2019 9:58 am

boronia wrote:
The extrusions are most probably off the shelf commercial products, and would require only minimal tooling to shape them. Let's see what happens.


But when in 'production' they would have had bending jigs. These wouldn't exist anymore.

A one-off batch would require either careful hand bending or the manufacture of the jigs first. Neither is particularly cheap.

A friend once asked a camping trailer company could they make a part for a trailer they hadn't sold for some years. The said no, none in stock anymore and we are not set up for one-offs, but here are the drawings, if you can find a fabricator willing to make it for you... (Which he did in the end, and it wasn't even all that expensive at some little suburban welding shop)
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Re: NSW Railway Observations 2019

Postby BroadGauge » Fri Jul 19, 2019 3:11 pm

Noticed during the afternoon on Wednesday that both trains running on Carlingford shuttles were 4 car C sets, instead of the scheduled K sets.
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Re: NSW Railway Observations 2019

Postby Swift » Fri Jul 19, 2019 8:39 pm

BroadGauge wrote:Noticed during the afternoon on Wednesday that both trains running on Carlingford shuttles were 4 car C sets, instead of the scheduled K sets.

I hope the C sets are regular here as they look a lot better with their styled fibreglass veneers that look "Comengy". The fronts remind me of a barn owl's face with their recessed eyes (windows). I hope some people get what I am saying. :)
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Re: NSW Future Rail Plan - NWRL/Metro/Harbour Crossing

Postby neilrex » Sat Jul 20, 2019 4:54 pm

when I travel on the western line, trains seem to scoot along very fast compared to the north shore line with all the corners. I am surprised that they are actually so slow.
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Re: NSW Future Rail Plan - NWRL/Metro/Harbour Crossing

Postby tonyp » Sat Jul 20, 2019 5:34 pm

neilrex wrote:when I travel on the western line, trains seem to scoot along very fast compared to the north shore line with all the corners. I am surprised that they are actually so slow.

It's because they stop along the way which drags down the average speed. The more they stop, the lower the average speed. They're not good stop-dwell-start performers, in contrast to the metro which is able to achieve higher average speeds in spite of stopping regularly. If the suburbans were allowed up to 130 on their longer express sections it should improve their average speeds a little.
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Re: NSW Railway Observations 2019

Postby Linto63 » Sun Jul 21, 2019 12:33 am

neilrex wrote:when I travel on the western line, trains seem to scoot along very fast compared to the north shore line with all the corners. I am surprised that they are actually so slow.
North Shore line has more curves in part due to it having some steep climbs, so it was built with curves to reduce ruling grades for steam locos.
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Re: NSW Railway Observations 2019

Postby tonyp » Sun Jul 21, 2019 8:21 am

The NSL has to rise to 190 meters at Wahroonga. If it seems slow now on the electrics, they originally revolutionized it. They brought about a big time saving and also a fairly consistent time uphill and downhill compared to the steam trains that took much longer on the uphill journey. I never use the NSL in my comparisons because it would be greatly unfair and unrealistic.
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Re: NSW Future Rail Plan - NWRL/Metro/Harbour Crossing

Postby Swift » Sun Jul 21, 2019 9:18 am

neilrex wrote:when I travel on the western line, trains seem to scoot along very fast compared to the north shore line with all the corners. I am surprised that they are actually so slow.

Reminds me of the 80s as a child going to Blacktown with my mum from Eastwood and seeing how fast those red sets could go. They were subdued on the Northern line in comparison.
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Re: NSW Railway Observations 2019

Postby boronia » Sun Jul 21, 2019 10:59 am

The (original) S sets and Us were a good ride between Blacktown and Penrith, drivers would really wind them up. The rough-riding bogies added to the effect.
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Re: NSW Railway Observations 2019

Postby tonyp » Sun Jul 21, 2019 11:53 am

Much of it is illusory. A train with poor sound insulation and a rough ride will look and feel as though it's doing 200 km/h while a modern quiet train doesn't seem to be going all that fast until you look out the window. Time the rate at which the "Griffiths Bros Teas" signs go past (if they're still there)!
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Re: NSW Railway Observations 2019

Postby ed24 » Sun Jul 21, 2019 3:37 pm

boronia wrote:The (original) S sets and Us were a good ride between Blacktown and Penrith, drivers would really wind them up. The rough-riding bogies added to the effect.

Agreed - enjoyed the farewell run this morning
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Re: NSW Future Rail Plan - NWRL/Metro/Harbour Crossing

Postby neilrex » Sun Jul 21, 2019 9:11 pm

tonyp wrote:
neilrex wrote:when I travel on the western line, trains seem to scoot along very fast compared to the north shore line with all the corners. I am surprised that they are actually so slow.

It's because they stop along the way which drags down the average speed. The more they stop, the lower the average speed. They're not good stop-dwell-start performers, in contrast to the metro which is able to achieve higher average speeds in spite of stopping regularly. If the suburbans were allowed up to 130 on their longer express sections it should improve their average speeds a little.


I sometimes wonder if you've ever actually been to Sydney.

The main reason that trains on the western T1 line seem fast, is not because of the curves or the gradients. Its because the typical trains I catch from the city to Hornsby stops at every station, and the typical train I catch from Central to Blacktown only stops at about 5 of them.
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Re: NSW Railway Observations 2019

Postby neilrex » Sun Jul 21, 2019 9:15 pm

A somewhat unusual observation at Gordon around 16:30 on Sunday.

A train departing to Hornsby (via Waitara) from Platform 2 at Gordon. In many decades, I have never seen a train do this in daylight. They often used to do it around 1:00 AM, not sure if they still do it then.
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Re: NSW Future Rail Plan - NWRL/Metro/Harbour Crossing

Postby tonyp » Sun Jul 21, 2019 10:50 pm

neilrex wrote:
The main reason that trains on the western T1 line seem fast, is not because of the curves or the gradients. Its because the typical trains I catch from the city to Hornsby stops at every station, and the typical train I catch from Central to Blacktown only stops at about 5 of them.

As I read it, you expressed surprise that the average speed of the western line was so low considering that they seem to scoot along. The reason is that every stop brings the average speed down, even five of them - though the figure you read was the average speed out to St Mary's, not Blacktown.
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