NSW Railway Observations 2019

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boronia
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Re: NSW Railway Observations 2019

Post by boronia »

Yes all those other lines are largely independent, although I have been in Tokyo when one of the JR local lines has shut down.
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Re: NSW Railway Observations 2019

Post by Frosty »

boronia wrote:'Very poorly planned': Trackwork on North Shore line creates another day of train chaos

https://www.smh.com.au/national/nsw/ver ... 50pcj.html

Presumably tickets to the cricket include travel, I wonder if this was added to the "Opal data"?
I'm assuming they did some planning choose this time in January it being quietest time of the year for patronage and general traffic on the roads.
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Where are the additional buses coming from ? What operators are doing rail replacement anyways ?
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Re: NSW Railway Observations 2019

Post by Linto63 »

ed24 wrote:Clearly plenty of trackwork around Chatswood is going to be required over the next few years - however, in some instances could they run trains from Hornsby to Gordon and then start all buses from the Gordon Bus Interchange?
Often happens that bus services only operate as far as Gordon with trains north thereof, presumably work is being at both ends of the line.
Frosty wrote:What operators are doing rail replacement anyways?
Transdev, North Sydney, and Telfords appear the main providers, supported by a number of smaller operators.
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Re: NSW Railway Observations 2019

Post by Stu »

^ Transit Systems West provided buses on Thursday and will be providing more buses.

TfNSW use pre-purchased ticket sales data to assist in scheduling the required number of buses for special event services although I'm not sure if the cricket at SCG was considered. Thr scheduling appears to be based on the office shutdown for the early new year which would be a minimal allocation of buses. The nice weather also brings out more crowds.
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Re: NSW Railway Observations 2019

Post by neilrex »

I was near Pymble for a while on Thursday evening around 6:45 PM, there was a bus every minute heading north, without loads of people on them.

I saw about 3 in 14 minutes, heading south, which were about 1/3 full.

A lot of the buses looked very old. I wonder if they found some more, after Wednesday's fiasco.

"Pre-purchased ticket data" may work if you are trying to predict patronage on special event routes to a major football game or something, along routes to Olympic Park where no bus services normally run. It's not going to tell you anything about rail patronage along a shut down line.
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Re: NSW Railway Observations 2019

Post by J_Busworth »

That whole North Shore rail replacement has been woeful this past week. Most of the buses I've seen in the city and North Sydney were STA, TSA and Hillsbus Stationlink who are certainly not the usual suspects for North Shore track work replacement. This is the second year in a row that they have got North Shore track work wrong over the summer period. You think they would learn
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Re: NSW Railway Observations 2019

Post by Linto63 »

Some operators have seemingly brought their oldest buses out for the occasion, North Sydney had a 1987 Mark 4 Mercedes O305, while Transdev had some early 90s Hinos. But nothing like when I was in London last year and anything including preserved buses in mint condition, some dating from the 40s, were brought in during an Underground strike.
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Re: NSW Railway Observations 2019

Post by aidenh37 »

Although I can agree the service wasn't as organised as it should've been, I can say that staff and customers did a fantastic job. Despite the madness and hot weather (most buses didn't have aircon) everyone was very forgiving and patient.

Transdev had their unused older buses from Mt Kuring-gai on, as you'd expect being the local depot. They also had some (mainly) Station Link drivers out as well, along with a few spare pink buses from Bankstown for the Wynyard to Macquarie University service and a few runs up to Hornsby and back.

Hillsbus also assisted with a few Station Link buses and drivers, however like Transdev they mostly sent out older spare buses, however they did have a few longer-distance coach bodied buses out too.

Punchbowl's buses made up a fair chunk of what was running too - and they looked to be the operator with the most air-conditioned buses running (excluding coaches). I think I saw a few CB80s around.

Coastal Liner had a CB80 on again, as usual for North Shore trackwork.

I don't think Chatswood was handled too well, too many buses for such a small space, especially now with Station Link services.

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Re: NSW Railway Observations 2019

Post by neilrex »

JR East said it detected a malfunction in the emergency braking system of a bullet train on the Tohoku-Yamagata shinkansen line at 9:50 a.m. Sunday.
The fault forced the train to stay on Track 23 of the station for more than 90 minutes,""

I get slightly annoyed when the media report that somebody was "forced" to do something. No, they usually "chose"" to do something.

For example, the police claim to be "forced" to close the freeway for 4 hours, because there was an accident. This is in fact usually a "choice", to bignote themselves, for some reason.

There is unlike to be an actual reason why a suspected malfunction of an emergency brake actually compels the train operator to not chose to drive the train very slowly and watchfully to a siding somewhere which does not block the main line, delaying tens of thousands of people.
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Re: NSW Railway Observations 2019

Post by boronia »

Well, the people involved "chose" to follow the rules that "force" them into what action to take.

Most organizations these days have Standard Operating Procedures. "If event X happens, the following actions must occur:". Such SOPs can cover a wide range of event X parameters/conditions, but deviation is not permitted until such time as the issue is resolved. Much of this comes about from OHS and public liability obligations.

This would be most prevalent in Japan, where deviation from the rules is considered most unprofessional. Individual decision making is culturally unacceptable. Without knowing exactly what the problem was, it is difficult to pass judgement. But knowing Japanese ethos of "keep the trains running at all costs", I'd guess this was a best case scenario.
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boronia
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Re: NSW Railway Observations 2019

Post by boronia »

Delays grow as internal report warns old trains in 'poor condition'

https://www.smh.com.au/national/nsw/del ... 50ome.html
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Re: NSW Railway Observations 2019

Post by Frosty »

boronia wrote:Delays grow as internal report warns old trains in 'poor condition'

https://www.smh.com.au/national/nsw/del ... 50ome.html
It will be interesting when will the K & C sets will be retired or scrapped it is very dependant on the cascade of OSCAR sets onto the suburban network. Making it reliant on smooth introduction of the NIF unlike the initial rollout of A sets. The K & C sets are in similar age to Comeng single deck trains in Melbourne which on the surface are in better condition although they had major refurbishment in the early 2000s and life extension project now under way. Lets hope this is the last summer with S sets.
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Re: NSW Railway Observations 2019

Post by neilrex »

The commeng trains in Melbourne appear to be in very good condition and are better to ride in than the newer trains are.

There seems to be an even higher level of stupidity than usual among the commenters on that story in the herald.
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Re: NSW Railway Observations 2019

Post by BroadGauge »

neilrex wrote:The commeng trains in Melbourne appear to be in very good condition and are better to ride in than the newer trains are.
I used to ride on them most days when I lived in that state, and unless something major has changed since I lived there, a large number of those sets used to run with traction motors cut out, often causing services to lose time, and along the outer section of my old line where trains could operate to their maximum allowed speed (115km/hr), if you were on a disc braked Comeng set it was impossible to even look at a mobile phone screen because of how much the carriages used to bounce around.

Also, if you're ever on one of the "north' sets (ex-Connex sets from when there were two train companies), if you bang your fist on one of the seat pads, you will find a seemingly endless amount of dirt pours out of them, due to the seat pads never having been cleaned or replaced for years.

I'm not sure why anybody would look towards Melbourne for an example of a great railway :twisted:
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Re: NSW Railway Observations 2019

Post by BanksfielderIdiot823 »

boronia wrote:Delays grow as internal report warns old trains in 'poor condition'

https://www.smh.com.au/national/nsw/del ... 50ome.html
Considering this "internal report" is from none other than Sydney Trains themselves, it sounds like another propagandist excuse for them to try and get rid of the C and K sets, along with the V Sets, XPT and Endeavour/Xplorers (i.e. the ICONIC, Australian-built trains of their respective networks) and bring another good name to their China-built Waratrashes.

My bullcrap meter is going through the roof.

It's also another tactic of diverting the blame for the delays from themselves; if there is poor condition on the trains, then it's their own fault since they just set them down and give all priority to the Waratahs. But then again as usual, they don't like the mere thought of taking responsibility for their wrongdoing.
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Re: NSW Railway Observations 2019

Post by neilrex »

It seems that when the actual delay is occurring, they seem to always blame signals, power failures, and trees.

But in this report, they are saying that the reliability of the actual trains themselves is the biggest problem.

Does anyone else see the perception of inconsistency here ?

I thought about why this might be so. The only explanation I could come up with, is that the supposedly unreliable trains cause minor cancellations and delays mostly, which don't make the news much, but signal failures cause the big fiascos, which do make the news.
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Re: NSW Railway Observations 2019

Post by boronia »

I have been a regular commuter, mainly on BMT trains, and casual traveller on other lines for over 15 years. I cannot recall ever being on a train that has completely failed in service during this time. Sure there have been delays, diversions and transpositions caused by other problems which are often never really explained.

Maybe I have been lucky, but my general impression is that maintenance has been satisfactory.
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Re: NSW Railway Observations 2019

Post by matthewg »

BanksfielderIdiot823 wrote: Considering this "internal report" is from none other than Sydney Trains themselves, it sounds like another propagandist excuse for them to try and get rid of the C and K sets, along with the V Sets, XPT and Endeavour/Xplorers (i.e. the ICONIC, Australian-built trains of their respective networks) and bring another good name to their China-built Waratrashes.
They want to get rid of the 'smaller' fleets. There are not really all that many K or C sets. There are a lot of V sets, but they use very old technology and the oldest have reached their fatigue life anyway and been withdrawn.

Sounds to me like they want to get rid of any train type the manufacturer will no longer take on 'outsourced' maintenance on. The M, A and B sets are under manufacture run maintenance. The Tangara's may get drawn into such an outsourced contract if their technology refresh ever actually happens.
But there would be little interest in taking on the pre-Tangara trains - too old, no modern 'diagnostic' computers. Have to employ fitters who actually know their stuff instead of keyboard jockeys. Anyone taking on their maintenance would charge a considerable risk premium. The C sets are electronic and computerised but are practically pre-series prototypes and very small in number. Probably only a hand full of people left in Mitsubishi who know how they actually work.

It's a prelude to fleet rationalisation to facilitate further outsourcing.
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Re: NSW Railway Observations 2019

Post by Campbelltown busboy »

BanksfielderIdiot823 wrote:Considering this "internal report" is from none other than Sydney Trains themselves, it sounds like another propagandist excuse for them to try and get rid of the C and K sets, along with the V Sets, XPT and Endeavour/Xplorers (i.e. the ICONIC, Australian-built trains of their respective networks) and bring another good name to their China-built Waratrashes.
Cityrail/Sydney Trains haven’t got any new Australian built trains for the suburban network since the end of the original suburban Tangara order
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Re: NSW Railway Observations 2019

Post by BroadGauge »

Campbelltown busboy wrote:Cityrail/Sydney Trains haven’t got any new Australian built trains for the suburban network since the end of the original suburban Tangara order
Where do you think the Millennium trains were built?
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Re: NSW Railway Observations 2019

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Big storm heading your way Sydneysiders.
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Re: NSW Railway Observations 2019

Post by Campbelltown busboy »

BroadGauge wrote:
Campbelltown busboy wrote:Cityrail/Sydney Trains haven’t got any new Australian built trains for the suburban network since the end of the original suburban Tangara order
Where do you think the Millennium trains were built?
China like the Waratah
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Re: NSW Railway Observations 2019

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Living in the Shire.
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Re: NSW Railway Observations 2019

Post by Frosty »

matthewg wrote:
BanksfielderIdiot823 wrote: Considering this "internal report" is from none other than Sydney Trains themselves, it sounds like another propagandist excuse for them to try and get rid of the C and K sets, along with the V Sets, XPT and Endeavour/Xplorers (i.e. the ICONIC, Australian-built trains of their respective networks) and bring another good name to their China-built Waratrashes.
They want to get rid of the 'smaller' fleets. There are not really all that many K or C sets. There are a lot of V sets, but they use very old technology and the oldest have reached their fatigue life anyway and been withdrawn.

Sounds to me like they want to get rid of any train type the manufacturer will no longer take on 'outsourced' maintenance on. The M, A and B sets are under manufacture run maintenance. The Tangara's may get drawn into such an outsourced contract if their technology refresh ever actually happens.
But there would be little interest in taking on the pre-Tangara trains - too old, no modern 'diagnostic' computers. Have to employ fitters who actually know their stuff instead of keyboard jockeys. Anyone taking on their maintenance would charge a considerable risk premium. The C sets are electronic and computerised but are practically pre-series prototypes and very small in number. Probably only a hand full of people left in Mitsubishi who know how they actually work.

It's a prelude to fleet rationalisation to facilitate further outsourcing.
It does have advantages to Sydney Trains for manufacture run maintence model they can shift the blame of any maintenance issues to the outsourced company. Would it be possible with the next batch of trains B sets 2.0 mean change in fleet allocation for lines with T2,T3 & T8 moving to exclusively M sets, B sets and some A sets. Alternatively enabling 100% A sets on the T1 line.
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Re: NSW Railway Observations 2019

Post by BanksfielderIdiot823 »

Campbelltown busboy wrote:China like the Waratah
The Mills are built in Australia, and so were the last locally built trains for the intercity network; the OSCARs. Hell, even the Hunter Railcars were built in Australia.
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