• Advertisement

STA Observations - December 2017

Sydney / New South Wales Transport Discussion

Re: STA Observations - December 2017

Postby Swift » Wed Dec 20, 2017 9:04 pm

boronia wrote:Normally I am very happy for any bus to come along, it bothers me not in the least who made the chassis, engine, gearbox or body work.
.

Not me. I groan if an 0500LE gas comes too many times in a row. I felt abit that way when a Bustech came along today, until I experienced it's superb a/c in the 35 degree heat! It was ice cold.
American Poor Handling, Floaty Riding Tank of the Week: 1978 AMC Matador Barcelona.
User avatar
Swift
 
Posts: 9509
Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2004 12:23 pm
Location: Ettalong- the world capital of 0405s.
Has thanked: 534 times
Been thanked: 419 times
Favourite Vehicle: Porshe 911 Carerra

Re: STA Observations - December 2017

Postby Frosty » Wed Dec 20, 2017 9:47 pm

I groan during summer days if Scania Ansair bus shows up 8/10 times the AC is hopeless on it. Bustech’s AC work quite well still not a fan though of the stiff hard seating.

Though P’s rostering is bizarre particularly on weekends. On Saturday there’s a significant mix of all types of buses on the L94, 393/395 a couple of 1.5 door bendies then often the m20 gets 12.5m Buses from P & T. Sunday one or two B12 Volgrens on the L94.

Any updates though on Scania K310UB CB 80 bit weird currently only a singular unit. The B8RLE will also be significant first Euro 6 bus for STA.
Frosty
 
Posts: 1601
Joined: Sat Jun 27, 2015 7:16 pm
Has thanked: 16 times
Been thanked: 99 times

Re: STA Observations - December 2017

Postby Jurassic_Joke » Thu Dec 21, 2017 1:07 am

Frosty wrote:I groan during summer days if Scania Ansair bus shows up 8/10 times the AC is hopeless on it. Bustech’s AC work quite well still not a fan though of the stiff hard seating.

Though P’s rostering is bizarre particularly on weekends. On Saturday there’s a significant mix of all types of buses on the L94, 393/395 a couple of 1.5 door bendies then often the m20 gets 12.5m Buses from P & T. Sunday one or two B12 Volgrens on the L94.

Any updates though on Scania K310UB CB 80 bit weird currently only a singular unit. The B8RLE will also be significant first Euro 6 bus for STA.


The 0405NH CNG are honestly the Millennium train of the STA Fleet (built around the same time too), because of the fridge-like air-conditioning. Complete relief in this heat. As much as I don't like Bustechs I do have to admit the AC is also decent - is is automatic? Feels the exact same every time. Scania Ansair is horrible I got one a few days ago, and it felt like it just the (hot) outside air being ventilated through the vents, no coolness. Completely useless. 0500LE is a really horrible hit and miss too and thats funny given I see it as an (almost) direct successor to the 0405NH CNG. OH but wait that's not unsurprising, Waratahs were a direct successor to Millenniums and they had worse air-conditioning

As for the Port Botany Scania CB80, I still haven't seen it with my own eyes - is it really that rare?
Scania K280UB CB80 > Volvo B7RLE CB80

Millennium > Waratah
User avatar
Jurassic_Joke
 
Posts: 663
Joined: Sun Dec 27, 2015 9:08 pm
Location: North Snore
Has thanked: 45 times
Been thanked: 84 times
Favourite Vehicle: STA Scania K280UB CC CB80

Re: STA Observations - December 2017

Postby Swift » Thu Dec 21, 2017 7:59 am

0405NHs are normally brilliant at giving respite from horrible hot humid days, but one I rode earlier this year was just blowing ambient air. All I can say is thank heavens I was only riding it a few stops on Anzac Pde. I still came out if it sweating like a piglet. Was tempted to voice my displeasure to the driver but didn't see the point. I'm sure he wouldn't deliberately (or could) run it on fan only.
On another note, I noticed TNSW Scania 3727 with an M run plate doing a 374 in Randwick shops. At first I wondered if this was a new level of route sharing where Willoughby is now doing Coogee runs(!), but then saw the Randwick depot accred on the side.
American Poor Handling, Floaty Riding Tank of the Week: 1978 AMC Matador Barcelona.
User avatar
Swift
 
Posts: 9509
Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2004 12:23 pm
Location: Ettalong- the world capital of 0405s.
Has thanked: 534 times
Been thanked: 419 times
Favourite Vehicle: Porshe 911 Carerra

Re: STA Observations - December 2017

Postby Ray » Thu Dec 21, 2017 1:56 pm

I think on the older Oranas, the driver controls the temperature to an extent?? Or at least whether it runs on heat, fan or cool.

Usual problem is too cold in winter or fan in summer....
Go Cats.
User avatar
Ray
 
Posts: 1044
Joined: Mon Mar 08, 2004 7:13 am
Has thanked: 10 times
Been thanked: 50 times

Re: STA Observations - December 2017

Postby Swift » Thu Dec 21, 2017 8:16 pm

Yes, older ""Scainias" have it but later ones have a pissy little rocker switch you wouldn't use on a home appliance, to turn on a climate control with a digital readout showing the temp. Whatever sensors were used quickly failed as the so call climate control just pumped out refrigerated air, whatever the outside climate was. With the old controls, the driver could at least select heat or ducted air only when refrigeration of the passengers wasn't required. I think STA is/was too preoccupied just keeping the buses mechanically fit for the road to bother with fine tuning temperature control or properly maintaining filters for the ducted air. Sometimes I think an impersonal juggernaut like the STA are better off leaving passengers to open the windows, instead of trying to run buses with politically motivated A/C.
American Poor Handling, Floaty Riding Tank of the Week: 1978 AMC Matador Barcelona.
User avatar
Swift
 
Posts: 9509
Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2004 12:23 pm
Location: Ettalong- the world capital of 0405s.
Has thanked: 534 times
Been thanked: 419 times
Favourite Vehicle: Porshe 911 Carerra

Re: STA Observations - December 2017

Postby Stu » Thu Dec 21, 2017 8:50 pm

Ray wrote:I think on the older Oranas, the driver controls the temperature to an extent?? Or at least whether it runs on heat, fan or cool.

Usual problem is too cold in winter or fan in summer....


14.5 and cng have the switch that can choose: heart / cool / hi fan / low fan.
The low entry models have the single switch on climate control.

Over the years some of the above models have had the air-con control switches replaced and have the opposite to what you would expect.
Stu
 
Posts: 3721
Joined: Tue Aug 25, 2009 5:37 pm
Has thanked: 116 times
Been thanked: 432 times

Re: STA Observations - December 2017

Postby Swift » Thu Dec 21, 2017 9:04 pm

Stu wrote:
14.5 and cng have the switch that can choose: heart / cool / hi fan / low fan.
The low entry models have the single switch on climate control.


The early low entry models had the multi modal switch as well. Should never have been changed. The reality is the so called climate control was just blowing cold air, rain, hail or shine.
American Poor Handling, Floaty Riding Tank of the Week: 1978 AMC Matador Barcelona.
User avatar
Swift
 
Posts: 9509
Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2004 12:23 pm
Location: Ettalong- the world capital of 0405s.
Has thanked: 534 times
Been thanked: 419 times
Favourite Vehicle: Porshe 911 Carerra

Re: STA Observations - December 2017

Postby Jurassic_Joke » Fri Dec 22, 2017 12:51 pm

Rick R wrote:There's a lot of over-simplification going on here. Just because some routes share parts of their paths doesn't mean that they are the same services and can be directly compared.

ALL routes which operate along or cross the B1's path can be considered feeders services to it, but they also carry a large percentage of passengers who have absolutely no need or intention of transferring to/from the B1.

This talk about 'duplication' completely misses the point that an excellent NETWORK is now operating on the north. The 'duplication' is in fact CHOICE, which gives passengers the freedom to get to where they are going.


STA haters gonna hate...


Just gunna weigh into this debate, as a someone that casually visits the Northern beaches, I'm perfectly happy with the new bus network up there. B1 to take you to all the hotspots up to Mona Vale on a brand new bus, and then a hoopla of standard buses to supplement it. People that whinge and live on the Northern beaches, id like to remind you could instead live in Glenfield with perhaps an hourly bus. So there. Stop whinging. They didnt have to invest in B-line yet still did as a thank you gift for re-election in 2015.

The only one thing that does NOT make sense to me was cutting the 155 between Manly and Narrabeen, especially as 155's route in Narrabeen isn't on Pittwater Road meaning everyone that lives out the back that travels southwards just got screwed over for the no reason. Otherwise, you know, I think the new network is pretty good.

They kept the L90. Truth is. If you ask me, they didn't have to. Having it run, on weekdays, during the off peak period in-between the morning and arvo peak, a paltry 1x an hour, seems oddly specific. If it wasn't an LNP electorate with many elderly that just don't like change, then I think they would've gotten rid of it because to be frank, as someone else pointed out, the L90 is the only bus remaining on the Northern beaches with an L prefix, while everything else got converted to an E- , which seems to definitely confirm that its being retained for nostalgia. B1 between Wynyard and Mona Vale pretty much supersedes the L90 in any way and then the 199 covers the remainder of the defunct L90. The only two key differences being stopping everywhere but also the questionable use of standard buses.

And I'm really happy with B-line generally. The only thing I'd do to make it truly perfect would to just extend it to QVB, so it feels "complete" and then it actually has something over L90, but I think the reason they aren't doing it is because of space restrictions. When I need to get further into the City coming from B1, I don't even bother to change to a train, I just walk it, but it definitely feels a bit cheap for a flagship bus to just end on the edge of the City instead of travelling further into it.

As for the cascading of the bendy buses, I think the reason why more haven't been moved is because I think they're taking a staged approach - they moved a limited number to start with, they'll see if they can do without more perhaps, and then you'll see probably more move down. I hope Leichardt gets some. As another example, route 180 Collaroy Plateau-Wynyard, before the new timetable id very often see it be run with a bendy, nowadays its almost always a standard bus
Scania K280UB CB80 > Volvo B7RLE CB80

Millennium > Waratah
User avatar
Jurassic_Joke
 
Posts: 663
Joined: Sun Dec 27, 2015 9:08 pm
Location: North Snore
Has thanked: 45 times
Been thanked: 84 times
Favourite Vehicle: STA Scania K280UB CC CB80

Re: STA Observations - December 2017

Postby swtt » Fri Dec 22, 2017 2:41 pm

Jurassic_Joke wrote:
Rick R wrote:There's a lot of over-simplification going on here. Just because some routes share parts of their paths doesn't mean that they are the same services and can be directly compared.

ALL routes which operate along or cross the B1's path can be considered feeders services to it, but they also carry a large percentage of passengers who have absolutely no need or intention of transferring to/from the B1.

This talk about 'duplication' completely misses the point that an excellent NETWORK is now operating on the north. The 'duplication' is in fact CHOICE, which gives passengers the freedom to get to where they are going.


STA haters gonna hate...

.

As for the cascading of the bendy buses, I think the reason why more haven't been moved is because I think they're taking a staged approach - they moved a limited number to start with, they'll see if they can do without more perhaps, and then you'll see probably more move down. I hope Leichardt gets some. As another example, route 180 Collaroy Plateau-Wynyard, before the new timetable id very often see it be run with a bendy, nowadays its almost always a standard bus


Send some over to B or Y depot which can then be deployed on peak hour 526/533 services to and from Rhodes/SOP

Sent from my Huawei Mate 9 using Tapatalk
User avatar
swtt
 
Posts: 4590
Joined: Mon Sep 21, 2009 4:49 pm
Has thanked: 766 times
Been thanked: 330 times

Re: STA Observations - December 2017

Postby burrumbus » Fri Dec 22, 2017 3:29 pm

I suspect why the bendies have been retained on the Northern Beaches is long heavily loaded school runs which need the capacity.Happy to be prooven wrong !!
burrumbus
 
Posts: 1779
Joined: Fri Apr 29, 2011 10:12 pm
Has thanked: 961 times
Been thanked: 393 times

Re: STA Observations - December 2017

Postby Swift » Fri Dec 22, 2017 3:31 pm

Speaking of the surrendered B12BLEAs so far, I noticed the female driver of 1693 had a beaming look on her face as she pulled into Maroubra Juncture in her steed. When I saw how peppy it was as it took off like a bullet, it all made sense. I noticed blue gray smoke shooting out the tail pipe though. Worn rings?
I think the suffering P drivers would like more of these toys to play with in their sandpit.
I think it's fantastic send them on Anzac Pde runs, instead of Pittwater Rd.
Last edited by Swift on Fri Dec 22, 2017 3:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.
American Poor Handling, Floaty Riding Tank of the Week: 1978 AMC Matador Barcelona.
User avatar
Swift
 
Posts: 9509
Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2004 12:23 pm
Location: Ettalong- the world capital of 0405s.
Has thanked: 534 times
Been thanked: 419 times
Favourite Vehicle: Porshe 911 Carerra

Re: STA Observations - December 2017

Postby swtt » Fri Dec 22, 2017 3:33 pm

burrumbus wrote:I suspect why the bendies have been retained on the Northern Beaches is long heavily loaded school runs which need the capacity.Happy to be prooven wrong !!


But the utilisation on only school runs, as opposed to other routes around the city, seems a little extravagant.
User avatar
swtt
 
Posts: 4590
Joined: Mon Sep 21, 2009 4:49 pm
Has thanked: 766 times
Been thanked: 330 times

Re: STA Observations - December 2017

Postby burrumbus » Fri Dec 22, 2017 3:42 pm

Agreed,but that's STA with some rather interesting rostering choices at the best of times.
As noted by others here, STA just don't have enough high capacity buses,compounded by strange rostering choices,to be utilised on the busiest routes.
burrumbus
 
Posts: 1779
Joined: Fri Apr 29, 2011 10:12 pm
Has thanked: 961 times
Been thanked: 393 times

Re: STA Observations - December 2017

Postby Swift » Fri Dec 22, 2017 3:45 pm

swtt wrote:
burrumbus wrote:I suspect why the bendies have been retained on the Northern Beaches is long heavily loaded school runs which need the capacity.Happy to be prooven wrong !!


But the utilisation on only school runs, as opposed to other routes around the city, seems a little extravagant.

Indulgent springs to mind. They have just had this B -line lavished on them and THEY still see fit to hold onto most of their large allocation of bendies as well. It doesn't add up. Hand them over F & V. :evil:
American Poor Handling, Floaty Riding Tank of the Week: 1978 AMC Matador Barcelona.
User avatar
Swift
 
Posts: 9509
Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2004 12:23 pm
Location: Ettalong- the world capital of 0405s.
Has thanked: 534 times
Been thanked: 419 times
Favourite Vehicle: Porshe 911 Carerra

Re: STA Observations - December 2017

Postby boronia » Fri Dec 22, 2017 3:51 pm

Strange rostering, indeed, when seen in isolation.

I get a 393 bus in the morning from Kensington around 06.45 to Central. It is usually crowded, sometimes a standing load. About 2 minutes behind is a 391, which usually has only 15-20 people on it. Guess which bus is a 14.5?

Perhaps the 14.5 is dictated by its later runs.
The Sydney Classic and Antique Truck (and Bus) Show
On again May 2018
@ The Museum of Fire.
User avatar
boronia
 
Posts: 17468
Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2004 5:18 am
Location: Sydney
Has thanked: 256 times
Been thanked: 1588 times
Favourite Vehicle: Dennis

Re: STA Observations - December 2017

Postby burrumbus » Fri Dec 22, 2017 4:12 pm

There doesn't appear to be a lot of analysis of loading stats,either by observation or by Opal .That would contribute to the strange rostering choices.There is also little effort made,from what I can figure, to allocate the high capacity buses permanently to the busiest runs.
burrumbus
 
Posts: 1779
Joined: Fri Apr 29, 2011 10:12 pm
Has thanked: 961 times
Been thanked: 393 times

Re: STA Observations - December 2017

Postby Frosty » Fri Dec 22, 2017 4:16 pm

Wouldn't hurt to remove some seats to create more standing room for those school bus runs beneficial for the kids health & short trips.

Probably guess the 391 is straight from the depot. Maybe STA/TfNSW should look into high capacity 12.5m buses. Though STA wouldn't want operate more bendy buses considering there is an additional cost in driver wages with the bendy bus drivers allowance. What I've seen also reluctance by STA there's a few Saturday early morning outbound 309 trips that are regularly full after Redfern Station wouldn't hurt to roster 14.5m or bendy buses.
Frosty
 
Posts: 1601
Joined: Sat Jun 27, 2015 7:16 pm
Has thanked: 16 times
Been thanked: 99 times

Re: STA Observations - December 2017

Postby burrumbus » Fri Dec 22, 2017 5:33 pm

Frosty,there are a reasonable number of school specials that operate from lower North Shore private schools and schools in the Manly area to the far reaches of the Northern Beaches.Newport,Avalon,Mona Vale,Bayview.Thats what I think the bendies have been retained for.
They are long routes with the AM and PM parts of the shift containing just the one trip in each half.Because of the length of the trip in both time and kms all students need a seat.Not only because of the demand of parents for a seat.Some poor utilsation for a bendy bus.Perhaps services that would be better operated by a private operator ?? Although STA have had these school specials for decades.
I also think the additional costs in drivers wages for a bendy shift would easily be outweighed by the cost in drivers wages and bus cost by using 2 standard buses.It just requires vastly improved rostering and the allocation of high capacity buses(14.4 metres and bendies)to the the busiest routes to provide the required capacity.
burrumbus
 
Posts: 1779
Joined: Fri Apr 29, 2011 10:12 pm
Has thanked: 961 times
Been thanked: 393 times

Re: STA Observations - December 2017

Postby Ben_Daui » Fri Dec 22, 2017 6:59 pm

boronia wrote:There will be 6 standard liveries
2652 is green and cream
2706 Mk 4
2799 red and cream
2559 Mk 2
2829 UTA Silver Service

and 6 "special event" liveries
one in Opera House livery so far

Pics on State Transit past and present FB page

Found a YouTube video linked from TG FB page enjoy:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SFkcbKcx9AI&sns=em
User avatar
Ben_Daui
 
Posts: 2099
Joined: Wed Nov 17, 2004 1:08 am
Has thanked: 202 times
Been thanked: 39 times
Favourite Vehicle: 14.5 Scania

Re: STA Observations - December 2017

Postby Frosty » Fri Dec 22, 2017 7:26 pm

In response to burrumbus if I remember correctly the old SSTS with the stripe tickets it said on the back that students should give up their seats to adults when required so I guess standing for kids are fine.

7news did a segment on the 85th anniversary of STA too https://twitter.com/7newssydney/status/ ... 5190106112
Will STA get to their centenary
Frosty
 
Posts: 1601
Joined: Sat Jun 27, 2015 7:16 pm
Has thanked: 16 times
Been thanked: 99 times

Re: STA Observations - December 2017

Postby burrumbus » Fri Dec 22, 2017 7:42 pm

No dramas Frosty.I think that applied to a route service with a mix of adults and students.Most of the route service/school specials that STA provide a relatively short trips.But with the current move to seat belts,operators tend to tailor thschool specials to reduce or eliminate standing students.There would be still a large number of route service/school specials with standing students over Sydney.The services I referred to above are straight school specials with no adults.Still poor utilisation for a bendy.
Not sure on your last sentence.I think that depends on the future operational performance of STA,plus the electoral fortunes of the current LIB/NAT government.Have a good night.
burrumbus
 
Posts: 1779
Joined: Fri Apr 29, 2011 10:12 pm
Has thanked: 961 times
Been thanked: 393 times

Re: STA Observations - December 2017

Postby Swift » Fri Dec 22, 2017 8:56 pm

I'm pretty sure the STA will make it to their 30 year anniversary 1989 -2019.
American Poor Handling, Floaty Riding Tank of the Week: 1978 AMC Matador Barcelona.
User avatar
Swift
 
Posts: 9509
Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2004 12:23 pm
Location: Ettalong- the world capital of 0405s.
Has thanked: 534 times
Been thanked: 419 times
Favourite Vehicle: Porshe 911 Carerra

Re: STA Observations - December 2017

Postby burrumbus » Sat Dec 23, 2017 2:25 am

Swift wrote:I'm pretty sure the STA will make it to their 30 year anniversary 1989 -2019.

Like that one swift.
burrumbus
 
Posts: 1779
Joined: Fri Apr 29, 2011 10:12 pm
Has thanked: 961 times
Been thanked: 393 times

Re: STA Observations - December 2017

Postby boronia » Sat Dec 23, 2017 7:18 am

Swift wrote:I'm pretty sure the STA will make it to their 30 year anniversary 1989 -2019.

Maybe only 3/4 of it?
The Sydney Classic and Antique Truck (and Bus) Show
On again May 2018
@ The Museum of Fire.
User avatar
boronia
 
Posts: 17468
Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2004 5:18 am
Location: Sydney
Has thanked: 256 times
Been thanked: 1588 times
Favourite Vehicle: Dennis

PreviousNext


  • Advertisement

Return to Discussion - Sydney / NSW

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 13 guests