STA Privatisation / Franchising

Sydney / New South Wales Transport Discussion
tonyp
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Re: STA Privatisation / Franchising

Post by tonyp »

Tonymercury wrote:
What are the drivers supposed to do about the traffic?
Taking a cue from how the trams used to plough through the traffic, fit the buses up with some brutal-looking timber and ironwork around the ends, like a P class tram, instead of the fancy plastic fairing so popular nowadays. I once did a drive to Sydney with a particularly beastly and jagged-looking industrial trailer on the back and I noticed that whenever I wanted to change lanes, the traffic would part like the Red Sea, rather than the normal blocking and cutting-off that is a usual everyday feature of driving in Sydney. 8)
Frosty
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Re: STA Privatisation / Franchising

Post by Frosty »

Tonymercury wrote: What are the drivers supposed to do about the traffic?
I guess some drivers might simply run set-down only more often or put the express/limited stops on the desto even if the trip is a regular all-stops service.
rogf24 wrote:I think they should seriously consider splitting the 303, 370 and 418. Handing over some of the 3xx and 5xx routes I think made some sense but the 348 (and M20) is one I don't really understand. The other ones have at least some justification, they're all really, really close to region 6, the 389 has history in region 6 as the 443 and the 440 also runs close to it and the M10 and M50 will no longer run to the South Eastern Suburbs once light rail opens. It's just the 348 and M20 that puzzles me.

Also, in that $5000 article, it mentioned the Transports Workers Union NSW. Have they already taken over from the RTBU in region 6?
The 348 is probably the proximity to Tempe Depot to Wolli Creek but I agree the m20 is puzzling it was probably most ideal when P & N operated with the assistance of M & R. In regards to the 303 very few trips go as a far Sans Souci most only go as far as Mascot and we all know the 370 is a lost cause maybe we should just have on-demand buses replace it.
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rogf24
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Re: STA Privatisation / Franchising

Post by rogf24 »

Frosty wrote:The 348 is probably the proximity to Tempe Depot to Wolli Creek but I agree the m20 is puzzling it was probably most ideal when P & N operated with the assistance of M & R. In regards to the 303 very few trips go as a far Sans Souci most only go as far as Mascot and we all know the 370 is a lost cause maybe we should just have on-demand buses replace it.
Lot of 303s go to Sans Souci.

https://transportnsw.info/documents/tim ... 180709.pdf
stajourneyman
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Re: STA Privatisation / Franchising

Post by stajourneyman »

You certainly wouldn't be climbing onto a 303 at San Souci to go the full distance into the City in peak hour unless you had a lot of time to burn.

With a trip duration of up to 1 hr and 45 minutes, you could probably jog there quicker than that!

I realise, of course, that there are various intermediate destinations, but to go from go to whoa wouldn't be practical.
stupid_girl
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Re: STA Privatisation / Franchising

Post by stupid_girl »

Frosty wrote:
Tonymercury wrote: What are the drivers supposed to do about the traffic?
I guess some drivers might simply run set-down only more often or put the express/limited stops on the desto even if the trip is a regular all-stops service.
As real time tracking apps are popular nowadays, I don't think this is acceptable. Some passengers may actually intend to board the all stops service based on the app.
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Re: STA Privatisation / Franchising

Post by Fleet Lists »

New region map for region 6 up on Transport Info https://static1.squarespace.com/static/ ... 072018.pdf
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boronia
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Re: STA Privatisation / Franchising

Post by boronia »

rogf24 wrote:I, the 389 has history in region 6 as the 443 and the 440 also runs close to it ?
The 389's history is predominantly R9, being North Bondi to the city. The 443 was just tacked onto the end of it to divert it away from CQ.

IIRC, the old industrial services that ran from the Pyrmont area to the east were Randwick/Waverley operated.
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Aurora
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Re: STA Privatisation / Franchising

Post by Aurora »

Am I the only person to find it strange 525 and 526 are now run by different operators? (525 STA and 526 TSA)
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robert
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Re: STA Privatisation / Franchising

Post by robert »

Aurora wrote:Am I the only person to find it strange 525 and 526 are now run by different operators? (525 STA and 526 TSA)
What is strange about it? The buses look the same, the timetables are centrally co-ordinated, the fares are the same, anecdotally the drivers are equally rude. The general public would barely be aware they were different operators.

And there are now many other examples of the same thing:

530 & 252/536
440 & all other Oxford St routes
508/M50 & all other Victoria Rd routes
M30 & all other Newtown routes
M30 & all other Military Rd routes
Forest routes along Warringah Rd & 136
280 & 142

Need I go on?
For information about private & Government bus routes in Sydney, look at http://www.sydneybusroutes.com
Frosty
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Re: STA Privatisation / Franchising

Post by Frosty »

Annoying that it must be a NSW thing that we can't provide an integrated region map the new R6 map only includes TSA services no other operators. PTV, Transperth, Translink can do it but not TfNSW.
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Re: STA Privatisation / Franchising

Post by marcnut1996 »

I agree, out of all the region maps of Sydney, only Hillsbus does it, showing STA, Busways and even Region 3 TSS services. Most of the places in Sydney are serviced by more than one operator, and an integrated map will give passengers informed choices of the possible routes to get from point A to point B.
Aurora wrote:Am I the only person to find it strange 525 and 526 are now run by different operators? (525 STA and 526 TSA)
I found it more strange that X25 and its parent route 525 are of different operators now. They should rename X25 as X26.
Last edited by marcnut1996 on Sun Jul 15, 2018 3:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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swtt
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Re: STA Privatisation / Franchising

Post by swtt »

Frosty wrote:Annoying that it must be a NSW thing that we can't provide an integrated region map the new R6 map only includes TSA services no other operators. PTV, Transperth, Translink can do it but not TfNSW.
Yes it's the fact that Newington/Wentworth Point pax need to have two region maps to get a full picture of their bus routes.

At least the Hillsbus ones show some other salient routes, e.g. M54. I guess the R6 one should really show the "sister" routes, such as 526, 458 and 533 which run well into the R6 territory.
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Re: STA Privatisation / Franchising

Post by J_Busworth »

Frosty wrote:Annoying that it must be a NSW thing that we can't provide an integrated region map the new R6 map only includes TSA services no other operators. PTV, Transperth, Translink can do it but not TfNSW.
The R9 map includes all the bus services in R9. Both STA and TSA operation
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Re: STA Privatisation / Franchising

Post by marcnut1996 »

That's because R9 map has not been updated yet, it shows R6 routes since they were all one operator in the past. Future R9 maps may or may not show R6 services.
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stupid_girl
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Re: STA Privatisation / Franchising

Post by stupid_girl »

J_Busworth wrote:
Frosty wrote:Annoying that it must be a NSW thing that we can't provide an integrated region map the new R6 map only includes TSA services no other operators. PTV, Transperth, Translink can do it but not TfNSW.
The R9 map includes all the bus services in R9. Both STA and TSA operation
It even still shows X03. :lol:
Stu
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Re: STA Privatisation / Franchising

Post by Stu »

marcnut1996 wrote: I found it more strange that X25 and its parent route 525 are of different operators now. They should rename X25 as X26.
X25 has always operated within R6 and has always been operated by R6 depots. X26 already exists a special event route. The X25 carries fresh air, I think that this route will be converted to a special event only route eventually, it has been used as a special event service twice.
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Re: STA Privatisation / Franchising

Post by Frosty »

If your coming from the east and travelling to Olympic Park it still probably faster to use the train all the way even with change at Lidcombe plus it probably be cheaper in comparison to X25 bus & train.
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rogf24
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Re: STA Privatisation / Franchising

Post by rogf24 »

Stu wrote: X25 has always operated within R6 and has always been operated by R6 depots. X26 already exists a special event route. The X25 carries fresh air, I think that this route will be converted to a special event only route eventually, it has been used as a special event service twice.
I see it loaded up packed at Strathfield heading to Olympic Park quite often during the AM rush, it's gets busy the other way in the PM but nowhere near AM.
Linto63
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Re: STA Privatisation / Franchising

Post by Linto63 »

13% year on year patronage increase for region 6, maybe all the bashers getting in a last ride. :D https://www.smh.com.au/national/nsw/lat ... 4zphp.html
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Re: STA Privatisation / Franchising

Post by marcnut1996 »

TfNSW website has the R6 contract with Transit Systems (https://www.transport.nsw.gov.au/system ... ract-6.pdf). Matters specific to Region 6 are mostly in the back half of the document, such as depots and facilities.

The url where I found the pdf/contract is https://www.transport.nsw.gov.au/operat ... ct_(SMBSC)

Unfortunately, I can't find the links to the attachments as mentioned in last few pages of the contract.
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iamthouth
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Re: STA Privatisation / Franchising

Post by iamthouth »

Thank you for that contract link. Interesting reading the on-demand phases, and seeing what is to come. The nominated on-demand areas correspond well to future replacement of certain existing services.

Class 3 KPI's are also removed, everything is now 1, 2 or 4.

There is also now a weighting for start, mid and end point in terms of On-Time running (75%, 15%, 10%), whereas previously the financial penalty for non-performance was only on the start point. There is also a gradual increase to the require OTR performance levels over the next six months.

There is also a measure of excess wait time for headway services, moving towards the London model.
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Re: STA Privatisation / Franchising

Post by stupid_girl »

It seems Region 6 contract area touches Parramatta. However, I can't think of any Region 6 routes going to Parramatta.
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Re: STA Privatisation / Franchising

Post by Tonymercury »

Page 333 of that document makes interesting reading!
tonyp
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Re: STA Privatisation / Franchising

Post by tonyp »

Tonymercury wrote:Page 333 of that document makes interesting reading!
I figured that Carbridge might be sewing up some more deals. It also shows that this can be done under an operational contract with a private and doesn't need a state operator to run with it.

With the seating capacity quoted, they may well be the three-door buses, same as Sydney Airport - but they only work well at the airport because entry is through all three doors, as well as exit. The achilles heel in these Carbridge models is the massive steps up to the high floor at the back. They are really really bad and foul up passenger distribution. This bus needs to have a fully stepless-gangway to work properly as a mass-transit vehicle.
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Re: STA Privatisation / Franchising

Post by jake_s_258 »

marcnut1996 wrote:TfNSW website has the R6 contract with Transit Systems (https://www.transport.nsw.gov.au/system ... ract-6.pdf). Matters specific to Region 6 are mostly in the back half of the document, such as depots and facilities.
Some of those catchment area maps are all over the place! The Earlwood to Kyeemagh map (page 200) has very specific carve-outs, going to great lengths to include all of Kyeemagh but omit all of Banksia, Wolli Creek and parts of Bardwell Park!
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