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Tangara upgrade contract awarded to UGL

Sydney / New South Wales Transport Discussion

Re: Tangara upgrade contract awarded to UGL

Postby Punchbowl Tiger Cub » Wed Mar 30, 2016 7:27 pm

Well that is the way it is.Plenty of fresh air expresses running everyday not just trains but in the bus ranks.

As far as energy use,there is very little saving running a 4 car set V an 8 car set.Trials are currently under way in terms of energy consumpion including savings from a complete stable of sets at completion of each day's running.
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Re: Tangara upgrade contract awarded to UGL

Postby Frosty » Wed Mar 30, 2016 7:29 pm

According the environmentalists we should be saving electricity through reducing power consumption.

I swear another plague of the NSW disease is coming of no common sense. Look at imagine an 8 car train on Sunday Morning doing shuttles on certain lines. Fixed permanent sets are bad ida in particular for Intercity trains. Can't we have train carriages like the Electrostar class in the UK walk through with open end gangways between cabs allowing easy access.

At the end of the day the Tangara train isn't a bad train. Yes they're a big flaws such as the real steep and narrow stairways and fixed seats. Someone should think about installing walk through end gangways on Tangara's.
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Re: Tangara upgrade contract awarded to UGL

Postby boronia » Wed Mar 30, 2016 7:52 pm

Why? Do you really need to walk through all 8 carriages?
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Re: Tangara upgrade contract awarded to UGL

Postby Swift » Wed Mar 30, 2016 8:17 pm

I wish they would make up fixed V sets and Oscars. The amount of times they have put on four cars when eight was plainly required is ludicrous.
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Re: Tangara upgrade contract awarded to UGL

Postby Fleet Lists » Wed Mar 30, 2016 8:22 pm

They may not have enough carriages to do that.
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Re: Tangara upgrade contract awarded to UGL

Postby Glen » Wed Mar 30, 2016 9:49 pm

Punchbowl Tiger Cub wrote: Those in power make the decisions about operating as 8 car sets - we just do our job and drive whatever is put in front of us.As seen with the A Sets and what will be the layout of all future purchases,all will be fixed permanent sets.This is for reliability and for safety reasons.(An outcome of the Waterfall accident)

I realise the policy is in place in NSW and it isn't about to change but, just so I know, how does running fixed 8 car sets relate to being "An outcome of the Waterfall accident"?

Punchbowl Tiger Cub wrote:Trials are currently under way in terms of energy consumpion including savings from a complete stable of sets at completion of each day's running.

That's another very 'NSW' way of doing things, leaving pantographs up all night. I think most other systems turn their trains off when they aren't needed.
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Re: Tangara upgrade contract awarded to UGL

Postby boronia » Wed Mar 30, 2016 9:50 pm

THis often happens when an 8 car set run is made up of an amalgamation of two 4 car sets, and one of the sets hasn't turned up in time.

Often happens at Central when sets have to be transposed from other runs to make up the shortfall. But perhaps sometimes they run out?
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Re: Tangara upgrade contract awarded to UGL

Postby Punchbowl Tiger Cub » Thu Mar 31, 2016 5:44 am

One outcome of Waterfall was for access/escape from the opposite end of a train in the event of collision or to go to a safe location etc etc.

Yes,there is trials going on to determine operational policy and proceedure on power savings.
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Re: Tangara upgrade contract awarded to UGL

Postby Tonymercury » Thu Mar 31, 2016 5:48 am

Glen wrote:
I'm glad I don't pay the power bills.


But you do!
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Re: Tangara upgrade contract awarded to UGL

Postby Glen » Fri Apr 01, 2016 7:01 am

Punchbowl Tiger Cub wrote:One outcome of Waterfall was for access/escape from the opposite end of a train in the event of collision or to go to a safe location etc etc.

Yes, but what is the link between that and dividing & amalgamating?
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Re: Tangara upgrade contract awarded to UGL

Postby Punchbowl Tiger Cub » Sat Apr 02, 2016 5:23 am

Fixed 8 car sets so unrestricted access throughout the train to reach the other end
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Re: Tangara upgrade contract awarded to UGL

Postby Glen » Sat Apr 02, 2016 12:17 pm

Punchbowl Tiger Cub wrote:Fixed 8 car sets so unrestricted access throughout the train to reach the other end

So on that basis, could no train ever be made up of two sets with full-width cabs in the middle?

That would surely have widespread implications.
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Re: Tangara upgrade contract awarded to UGL

Postby andy_centralcoast » Sat Apr 02, 2016 12:23 pm

The only timetabled use of 4 car T sets that I know of is the two northern line limited stops from Epping to Sydney Terminal. Each morning an 8 car T set divides into two 4 car trains in Hornsby yard. They run 30 minutes apart and join together again at Sydney Terminal.

Will the upgrade plans mean this service will need to be changed to Oscar or K/S sets?

Is there any other scheduled use of 4 car T sets?
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Re: Tangara upgrade contract awarded to UGL

Postby Swift » Sat Apr 02, 2016 3:24 pm

andy_centralcoast wrote:
Is there any other scheduled use of 4 car T sets?

What is used on the Carlingford line these days? I remember in the 1980s when that line seemed to be exclusively serviced by a three car red rattler.
I didn't see a modern double decker go up that line until some time in the early 1990s. I remember when I caught a Tangara along there from Dundas to Carlingford, I was thinking how far that line had come, lol.
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Re: Tangara upgrade contract awarded to UGL

Postby Transtopic » Sat Apr 02, 2016 7:48 pm

andy_centralcoast wrote:The only timetabled use of 4 car T sets that I know of is the two northern line limited stops from Epping to Sydney Terminal. Each morning an 8 car T set divides into two 4 car trains in Hornsby yard. They run 30 minutes apart and join together again at Sydney Terminal.

Will the upgrade plans mean this service will need to be changed to Oscar or K/S sets?

Is there any other scheduled use of 4 car T sets?

I expect that when the new timetable comes into operation after closure of the ECRL for metro conversion, all Northern Line suburban services (up to 10tph in the peak) will be 8 car consists routed via the Suburban track pair from Strathfield through to the Harbour Bridge and the North Shore. The Central terminators from Epping will cease.
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Re: Tangara upgrade contract awarded to UGL

Postby Ben_Daui » Sat Apr 02, 2016 8:00 pm

I wonder if they will re introduce a service that will utilize the new Homebush dive from the west to Hornsby to keep trains off the Nth Shore line?
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Re: Tangara upgrade contract awarded to UGL

Postby Frosty » Sun Apr 03, 2016 6:23 pm

Swift wrote:What is used on the Carlingford line these days? I remember in the 1980s when that line seemed to be exclusively serviced by a three car red rattler.
I didn't see a modern double decker go up that line until some time in the early 1990s. I remember when I caught a Tangara along there from Dundas to Carlingford, I was thinking how far that line had come, lol.


Most days a K set but more often than not a S set. A 4 car Tangara service was running during Christmas.
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Re: Tangara upgrade contract awarded to UGL

Postby swtt » Thu Apr 07, 2016 8:56 am

Ben_Daui wrote:I wonder if they will re introduce a service that will utilize the new Homebush dive from the west to Hornsby to keep trains off the Nth Shore line?


Not a chance.

Seriously, with a single line there?
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Re: Tangara upgrade contract awarded to UGL

Postby boronia » Thu Apr 07, 2016 9:36 am

swtt wrote:
Ben_Daui wrote:I wonder if they will re introduce a service that will utilize the new Homebush dive from the west to Hornsby to keep trains off the Nth Shore line?


Not a chance.

Seriously, with a single line there?

One of the "excuses" for cancelling "The River" service was it was too hard to get a path for it back onto the west line. With freights using the link between peaks, it might be even harder.
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Re: Tangara upgrade contract awarded to UGL

Postby BroadGauge » Thu Apr 07, 2016 11:28 am

andy_centralcoast wrote:Is there any other scheduled use of 4 car T sets?

What about the Waterfall to Port Kembla services on weekdays? Are they still using 4-car T sets, they were last year.
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Re: Tangara upgrade contract awarded to UGL

Postby Punchbowl Tiger Cub » Thu Apr 07, 2016 12:49 pm

Yes,but will change when four car T Sets are phased out.
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Re: Tangara upgrade contract awarded to UGL

Postby Swift » Thu Apr 07, 2016 1:15 pm

Anyone going to commemorate the last four car Tangarbage in service?
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Re: Tangara upgrade contract awarded to UGL

Postby Glen » Thu Apr 07, 2016 2:34 pm

swtt wrote:
Ben_Daui wrote:I wonder if they will re introduce a service that will utilize the new Homebush dive from the west to Hornsby to keep trains off the Nth Shore line?


Not a chance.

Seriously, with a single line there?

I think the days of 'once a day' trains has gone. What the commuters want is frequency.
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Re: Tangara upgrade contract awarded to UGL

Postby Glen » Thu Apr 07, 2016 2:35 pm

BroadGauge wrote:
andy_centralcoast wrote:Is there any other scheduled use of 4 car T sets?

What about the Waterfall to Port Kembla services on weekdays? Are they still using 4-car T sets, they were last year.

Punchbowl Tiger Cub wrote:Yes,but will change when four car T Sets are phased out.

Will they replace them with some other type of 4 car train instead?
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Re: Tangara upgrade contract awarded to UGL

Postby Swift » Thu Apr 07, 2016 2:46 pm

Likely a K set. It may be older but at least there are plenty of them and they are air conditioned. I don't see them putting on an eight car Tangara to replace a four car one.
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