New Intercity Fleet Purchases/Observation

Sydney / New South Wales Transport Discussion
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boronia
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Re: [Australian] Mike Baird buying new trains off the rack

Post by boronia »

Myrtone wrote:But that doesn't seem to happen on planes.
You don't get hordes of freeloading morons on planes.
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Re: [Australian] Mike Baird buying new trains off the rack

Post by Myrtone »

Why is that?
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Re: [Australian] Mike Baird buying new trains off the rack

Post by Frosty »

One planes are usually full so other passengers are more likely to know, two there are many flight crew aboard a plane so more likely you would get caught, three trains are wild.

Since do you ever see a graffitied plane the answer is no. The only vandalism on planes I can think of is accidental or by little children often because they're angry for what ever reason.
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Re: [Australian] Mike Baird buying new trains off the rack

Post by Myrtone »

It would be a good idea for every intercity train to have a crew of at least two.
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Re: [Australian] Mike Baird buying new trains off the rack

Post by Frosty »

Let's start moving the guard out of their little cab would be a good idea at least to a customer service assistant role. Similar to a conductor or train manager in the UK.
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Re: [Australian] Mike Baird buying new trains off the rack

Post by simonl »

Myrtone wrote:It would be a good idea for every intercity train to have a crew of at least two.
Wrong.
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boronia
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Re: [Australian] Mike Baird buying new trains off the rack

Post by boronia »

Myrtone wrote:It would be a good idea for every intercity train to have a crew of at least two.
They already do
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Re: [Australian] Mike Baird buying new trains off the rack

Post by simonl »

boronia wrote:
Myrtone wrote:Maybe the radio, maybe the sort of things they would hear on a plane.
Most people have their own music devices these days. On planes, the headphones are part of a larger entertainment system, too complex for a train.

USB ports should be sufficient. Most people should be able to survive for an hour or two without wi-fi
Also, people can be on planes for 12 hours and then not have access to charger before getting on another plane. I don't think spending a couple of hours on an intercity requires USB ports.

QR have WiFi on selected trains, which is good for a few coverage black spots on the Gold Coast line.
boronia wrote:
Myrtone wrote:It would be a good idea for every intercity train to have a crew of at least two.
They already do
Yes, but this plan reduces the crewing requirement to one. Something I enthusiastically support.
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Re: [Australian] Mike Baird buying new trains off the rack

Post by rogf24 »

Myrtone seems to be trolling the thread.
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boronia
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Re: [Australian] Mike Baird buying new trains off the rack

Post by boronia »

simonl wrote:
boronia wrote: Most people have their own music devices these days. On planes, the headphones are part of a larger entertainment system, too complex for a train.

USB ports should be sufficient. Most people should be able to survive for an hour or two without wi-fi
Also, people can be on planes for 12 hours and then not have access to charger before getting on another plane. I don't think spending a couple of hours on an intercity requires USB ports.
Many people going home after work would likely find their phone or tablet batteries going low, so perhaps the opportunity to top them up while travelling would be a nice touch. Of course they could get a power bank booster, I find these very handy.
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Re: [Australian] Mike Baird buying new trains off the rack

Post by simonl »

Liamena wrote:Woy Woy. Koolewong . Warnervale. Adamstown . Probably one or two I have forgotten.

I'm not actually sure what a "stuff load" is.

It's not many. You would get that many travelling 5 km along most Melbourne lines, and with much more frequent trains than the central coast line actually carries.
That's probably too many to grade separate for the benefit. There were a few in the bit of Newcastle which has been closed.
boronia wrote:Many people going home after work would likely find their phone or tablet batteries going low, so perhaps the opportunity to top them up while travelling would be a nice touch. Of course they could get a power bank booster, I find these very handy.
In some cases - yeah.

Office workers will have USB points in their PC.
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Re: [Australian] Mike Baird buying new trains off the rack

Post by boronia »

A few don't seem to have access, or don't bother - like the queues to top up Opal cards in the PM peak -I find it amusing to watch people at Central waiting for a train, with a phone charger plugged into a power point trying to get their phone battery level up enough for the trip home. How much extra time would one get from, say, a 15 minute boost to a near empty battery?
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Re: [Australian] Mike Baird buying new trains off the rack

Post by simonl »

Or maybe they don't have the USB cable which they would still need to use a USB port on the train.
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rogf24
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Re: [Australian] Mike Baird buying new trains off the rack

Post by rogf24 »

In that case, you should tell TfNSW that the trains should provide a male USB (hopefully type-C) or Lightning cable instead of a female port. Like the thing Chargebar provides.

Like this: https://www.chargebar.com.au/product/albion/

Maybe you get a whole bunch of generic ones made in China or Korea for cheaper that^^.
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Re: [Australian] Mike Baird buying new trains off the rack

Post by simonl »

Or people should just charge their phones or deal with them not being charged, and not shift the onus to the transport provider.
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Re: [Australian] Mike Baird buying new trains off the rack

Post by rogf24 »

You can charge your phone in the car using a the standard 12-volt socket you can find in any old car. If you want the train to continue to be competitive with driving, then these sort of extras are essential to keeping people on trains. Just like the V-sets with comfy seats were in the past.

Even the New York Subway is getting USB charging on board trains and that's a metro, not an intercity service.
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Re: [Australian] Mike Baird buying new trains off the rack

Post by boronia »

That would be an interesting exercise considering these are "standee" type cars with longitudinal seating. Are they going to put the sockets in the hand straps? :P
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Re: [Australian] Mike Baird buying new trains off the rack

Post by Mr OC Benz »

rogf24 wrote:You can charge your phone in the car using a the standard 12-volt socket you can find in any old car. If you want the train to continue to be competitive with driving, then these sort of extras are essential to keeping people on trains. Just like the V-sets with comfy seats were in the past.

Even the New York Subway is getting USB charging on board trains and that's a metro, not an intercity service.
Trains on the Perth urban rail network (along with some buses and the stations) are gradually getting USB charging ports fitted too with new deliveries also having them fitted. They are fitted in the standing areas at the end of each car and near the doors. There was a lot of hype and attractiveness from younger people when they were introduced.

Certainly there have been a few times where my phone has gone flat (which is normally a rarity for me) when I'm out all day and I've needed to charge. These days, many people are reliant on technology for almost everything and even portable battery packs are limited in their capacity, so being able to charge on the go is extremely convenient. You'd be surprised how even a 10 minute charge is a life saver if it's enough to get you to your destination for where you can charge properly.
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Re: [Australian] Mike Baird buying new trains off the rack

Post by jpp42 »

Why are you all going on and on about USB ports. Isn't the bigger deal here that they chose the consortium with zero Australian manufacturing content? At least Waratahs had final assembly here. These are almost going to drive themselves odff the ship.

This is a huge blow to the Hunter manufacturing. Queensland and Victoria still do some train building, now NSW will permanently lose that capability.
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Re: [Australian] Mike Baird buying new trains off the rack

Post by rogf24 »

While the selected consortium does not have local manufacturing, it's important to note that there is no loss of local expertise especially considering that UGL was selected. This would have been the reverse if Stadler was selected for example.

It is disappointing nonetheless.
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boronia
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Re: [Australian] Mike Baird buying new trains off the rack

Post by boronia »

Might it be a similar deal to the Waratahs, with fitting out done locally?
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Re: [Australian] Mike Baird buying new trains off the rack

Post by Myrtone »

Frosty wrote:One planes are usually full so other passengers are more likely to know, two there are many flight crew aboard a plane so more likely you would get caught, three trains are wild.

Since do you ever see a graffitied plane the answer is no. The only vandalism on planes I can think of is accidental or by little children often because they're angry for what ever reason.
This is a very good reason against reduction of crew on trains, and maybe allowing the guard out of the guard's cab as described above.
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Re: [Australian] Mike Baird buying new trains off the rack

Post by Punchbowl Tiger Cub »

Should be built here for the sake of ongoing manufacturing capacity,employment,training of apprentices,material supplies etc etc.

Hyundai will turn out a good product but to our loss.

Go to Victoria and see ongoing manufacturing of railway stock in that state.Yet another extension order of Velocity sets has been signed for.

Ongoing maintenance capacity only provides 200 long term jobs and does not bring expertise - just people who can change parts off the shelf
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Re: [Australian] Mike Baird buying new trains off the rack

Post by rogf24 »

I was thinking about design, development and engineering. That would have been shipped off to Switzerland if it went to Stadler, as was the case with Sydney Metro trains to France. At least with UGL, we get to keep more (if not all) of that here.
Last edited by rogf24 on Thu Aug 18, 2016 9:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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boronia
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Re: [Australian] Mike Baird buying new trains off the rack

Post by boronia »

Punchbowl Tiger Cub wrote:
Go to Victoria and see ongoing manufacturing of railway stock in that state.Yet another extension order of Velocity sets has been signed for.
And new trams being built there, at a considerable price premium. Perth's trains built in Qld?

But aren't the Metro trains fully imported?
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