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Opal Card Fare Issues

Sydney / New South Wales Transport Discussion

Re: Opal Card Fare Issues

Postby boronia » Thu Mar 03, 2016 7:49 pm

I'm aware of that. It's just that I have this passion for whinging about such things for the sake of it LOL :evil:
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Re: Opal Card Fare Issues

Postby moa999 » Thu Mar 03, 2016 9:37 pm

The root cause, as I'm sure you know already, is likely a failed GPS on the bus, in conjunction with a driver that wasn't attentive enough to manually advance the system from stop to stop.


Albeit in most cases this would result in a reversal (as the tag off location is same as tag on).

In this case the GPS has seemingly not worked from route commencement at Little Bay to Kensington, before switching on before Central

Only other thing I can think of is a driver change nearby whereby power was incorrectly shutoff so the system defaulted to start of route (as the driver logged in) before it established GPS. (Had this occur to me in the early days boarding at Edgecliff and being charged from Watson's Bay)
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Re: Opal Card Fare Issues

Postby boronia » Thu Mar 03, 2016 9:50 pm

The bus starts from Little Bay about 0600, so I doubt driver change could be blamed.
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Re: Opal Card Fare Issues

Postby Frosty » Fri Mar 04, 2016 6:35 am

boronia wrote:The bus starts from Little Bay about 0600, so I doubt driver change could be blamed.


Could be a problem when the driver finished another route and then headed to Little Bay since I know a few 309/391s run empty becoming 393s at Little Bay. Drivers probably also like to take a break at P depot and shutoff in between empty runs/breaks if they're near Port Botany Depot which is near Little Bay. Maybe driver failed to shut down properly after going the depot for a quick snack or toilet break in between runs nearby P depot.
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Re: Opal Card Fare Issues

Postby boronia » Fri Mar 04, 2016 5:28 pm

I'm not really worried abut the cause, as the problem is negated by the daily cap which I would have been well over.

As a result of my complaint, I got an email today advising that the overcharge had been refunded, so my day out only cost $2.00 :D
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Re: Opal Card Fare Issues

Postby Stu » Fri Mar 11, 2016 8:56 pm

moa999 wrote:
The root cause, as I'm sure you know already, is likely a failed GPS on the bus, in conjunction with a driver that wasn't attentive enough to manually advance the system from stop to stop.


Albeit in most cases this would result in a reversal (as the tag off location is same as tag on).

In this case the GPS has seemingly not worked from route commencement at Little Bay to Kensington, before switching on before Central

Only other thing I can think of is a driver change nearby whereby power was incorrectly shutoff so the system defaulted to start of route (as the driver logged in) before it established GPS. (Had this occur to me in the early days boarding at Edgecliff and being charged from Watson's Bay)



The reason for being accidentally charged from Watsons Bay is explained in the link below (Opal Infrastructure - pg 104). I used an example of route 389 although the issue also happens on routes 324 & 325. I don't know how the power in the bus can be incorrectly shutdown, I thought that it was a simple matter of turning the key to the left in the ignition to switch off the engine. Even if the battery is switched off, the opal console will still continue to work.

http://www.busaustralia.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=66085&start=2575
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Re: Opal Card Fare Issues

Postby Stu » Fri Mar 11, 2016 9:06 pm

Frosty wrote:
boronia wrote:The bus starts from Little Bay about 0600, so I doubt driver change could be blamed.


Could be a problem when the driver finished another route and then headed to Little Bay since I know a few 309/391s run empty becoming 393s at Little Bay. Drivers probably also like to take a break at P depot and shutoff in between empty runs/breaks if they're near Port Botany Depot which is near Little Bay. Maybe driver failed to shut down properly after going the depot for a quick snack or toilet break in between runs nearby P depot.


Shutting the bus down (correctly or incorrectly?) will not affect the console. The driver will still remain logged in and the driver would normally place the console into 'driver break' mode. Once a trip has been ended and the bus remains stationary, the console will automatically switch over to driver break mode after approximately 3-5 minutes.
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Re: Opal Card Fare Issues

Postby Newcastle Flyer » Sun Apr 17, 2016 9:48 am

I'm curious, with employee what was gold passes (I think), now & to be employee opal cards (also I think), if or when the privatise Newcastle Buses & Ferries, will they still be allowed to use them, as a government transport employee can't use them on private public transport.

Another issue (that I can't find) which is why this is in this thread, is I believe that one no tap off can be considered a mistake, but multiple no tap offs could be considered an abuse of the opal card, and could be taken away from them.
But what happens when it's the opal machine that is not working, or you actually tap off, but the machine when it's (or if it's) reviewed, says you didn't tap off? (1). How does a person with said pass prove that it wasn't his/her fault?

1. I get that often with a normal opal card, where it claims I didn't tap off, but I did really tap off.
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Re: Opal Card Fare Issues

Postby Fleet Lists » Sun Apr 17, 2016 10:57 am

I have never heard of any threat to deactivate card because of multiple no tap offs - i suspect that you heard some false rumour. Why would they deactivate them when they are making money out of trips which are not tapped off?

As far as the employee cards are concerned, only time will tell but I would think that they would continue to be valid on the ex Newcastle buses as a special matter but still not valid on other private buses. Probably much the same as the Sydney Ferries which are now privately operated.
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Re: Opal Card Fare Issues

Postby Route548 » Sun Apr 17, 2016 11:02 am

Fleet Lists wrote:I have never heard of any threat to deactivate card because of multiple no tap offs - i suspect that you heard some false rumour. Why would they deactivate them when they are making money out of trips which are not tapped off?


It is actually part of the agreement that you sign for when you get the employee OPAL card. They are just enforcing what the rule is under the old magnetic stripe pass which is essentially you must tap on and off at the start and end of each trip.

Only difference is now it is a lot easier for the powers that be to monitor card usage than in the past. Also, the cynic in me suggests that if enough people do not tap on or off using their employee card, it would give the govt the perfect excuse to cancel the benefit once and for all and save themselves an oodle in FBT (trips might be free but it is a benefit paid for by the employer).
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Re: Opal Card Fare Issues

Postby Passenger 57 » Sun Apr 17, 2016 11:36 am

Tapping off is also a condition of the standard Opal TOU, as is cancellation of the card with forfeiture of any credit balance for breaches of the TOU. Not tapping off is also in breach of the transport regulations for ferries and trains but not for buses.
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Re: Introducing OPAL Card

Postby jpp42 » Mon Apr 25, 2016 4:40 pm

The Opal Travel app is telling me I've reached the weekly travel reward despite it clearly being Monday and only three journeys so far today. Anyone else seeing this?
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Re: Opal Card Fare Issues

Postby boronia » Mon Apr 25, 2016 5:14 pm

Gee, you got a better deal than me. Last week, after just 3 journeys, it told me I had only 2 to go to get free travel. But they charged me for journey 6, my last for the week.

So far this week it is correct, but I will keep an eye on it.
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Re: Opal Card Fare Issues

Postby Jurassic_Joke » Mon Apr 25, 2016 9:04 pm

jpp42 wrote:The Opal Travel app is telling me I've reached the weekly travel reward despite it clearly being Monday and only three journeys so far today. Anyone else seeing this?


Mmmmmmm, mine still says 43 journeys completed (from last week) / Weekly Travel Reward reached. Thought I may be the only one, good to hear.
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Re: Opal Card Fare Issues

Postby moa999 » Mon Apr 25, 2016 10:49 pm

Mine certainly reset online as usual.
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Re: Introducing OPAL Card

Postby andy_centralcoast » Fri Oct 07, 2016 6:14 am

Channel nine news special report reveals millions of Opal users have been overcharged, with up to 25,000 Opal card users overcharged each day. http://snpy.tv/2dGHH1E
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Re: Opal Card Fare Issues

Postby Liamena » Tue Oct 11, 2016 11:56 am

That claim is wrong. The "default fare", if you don't tap off, is the same as the normal fare to the end of the route. Many people probably know this. They are not being "overcharged" if that is the correct fare for the part of the route which they have used, anyway.
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Re: Opal Card Fare Issues

Postby simonl » Tue Oct 11, 2016 12:41 pm

It then doesn't count for 8 per week though so you might pay more for subsequent journeys.
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Re: Opal Card Fare Issues

Postby Fleet Lists » Tue Oct 11, 2016 12:58 pm

But whose fault is that? I dont believe it is a case of overcharging under such circumstances.
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Re: Opal Card Fare Issues

Postby molybtek » Tue Oct 11, 2016 1:51 pm

It is if the reader died during the trip after you have tapped on, but cannot tap off.
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Re: Opal Card Fare Issues

Postby moa999 » Tue Oct 11, 2016 2:45 pm

Most incorrect tag offs I see on the buses are from Gold Card holders who either can't tap properly, can't distinguish the tone, or don't care given the $2.50 cap anyways
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Re: Opal Card Fare Issues

Postby simonl » Tue Oct 11, 2016 3:13 pm

Fleet Lists wrote:But whose fault is that? I dont believe it is a case of overcharging under such circumstances.

I agree with you. However such facts would not get in the way of a media beat up.
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Re: Opal Card Possibility of incorrect Calcuating fares...

Postby matthewg » Mon Oct 24, 2016 5:35 pm

3808 wrote:PGT - one possible explanation for your July experience is that once the day-cap is reached on a Sunday, the system doesn't bother doing the other adjustments. It would be interesting to see what would happen if someone did the same journey sequence on a weekday.


It would appear from my observations that once any cap is reached, the journey counter / transfer logic is no longer applied.
I suspect there is an 'optimisation' in the system such that if the day cap has applied and the fare is zero, it jumps straight to closing off the transaction and does no further processing - skipping the journey count / transfer logic.
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Re: Opal Card Fare Issues

Postby CCCC » Mon Oct 24, 2016 9:00 pm

ok here goes.

Noticed I seemed to still have a high amount on my opal card the last time I had used it , so yesterday I actually took notice of the bip's and total amount at the tap on tap off machine.
Got on at Gordon $36.94 and off at Town Hall $36.94 , did the return and at Grodon it still was showing $36.94 , the gates opened up ok at Town Hall .

So am I going to come unstuck with this card when it gets checked by an inspector. ????
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Re: Opal Card Fare Issues

Postby moa999 » Mon Oct 24, 2016 9:47 pm

What does the online account say?

Had you already hit your weekly or Sunday cap?
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