'The Hop' Branding Rollout

[sunnyyan]

Museum station has new plastic signs on the stairs saying:
Australian Museum ==>
via Liverpool street

Although I didn't notice any more of these signs at the actual exit. Whoever follows these signs might just get lost.
Also, most of Museum's Hop branding is done on plastic (the type that's on temporary signs), as opposed to the metal signs at other station.

[andy_centralcoast]

E.g. at Central Platform 16, Next Station: Town Hall.
(Probability of a train skipping Town Hall is terribly low)

Just when the Central Coast trains are diverted via the north shore and are made first stop Chatswood from Central.

[Bjwh86]

Before going off-topic, just some observations.

Really the only parts of the roll-out left are some stations and the majority of the bus network.

Both the Hunter Line, Southern Highlands (and the un-electrified South Coast branch) have all been completed. The most significant difference to Sydney is they've taken a page out of the British Rail handbook with line information at each station entrance and on platforms if required. (example imgur.com/a/9Lfuj)

The people over at Lee Street have also seemed to gotten the point and now Main North stations are now putting up *Trains to X* at concourses. I take the Next Station signage will only be restricted to interchanges.

I think the Next Station signage will be at places where the train on the platform, except terminating services, are guaranteed to stop there.

E.g. at Central Platform 16, Next Station: Town Hall.
(Probability of a train skipping Town Hall is terribly low)

not really as Parramatta has "next station Harris Park" on platform 1 and hardly and trains stop there from that platform.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Jurassic_Joke]

Flemington station upgrade is now more or less complete.

I have quite mixed views on the matter.

PROS:

-They actually got the signage right! Woo! To the two platforms in use, the signs now say respectively, Platform 3 - trains towards City, Platform 4 - trains towards Lidcombe. Already miles better than the Gladys stuffup that was removing service information from platform signs altogether. Maybe we really will see some improvements with Andrew now in charge.

-More Opal poles at the bottom of the stairs.

-New footbridge to Sydney Markets is much faster, less walking time, and still offers some nice views.


CONS

-The new station concourse is more or less yet ANOTHER Newtown-Glenfield clone (sans gates), ie, a concourse with a black roof over the middle of the platform. And Croydon will be the next by the looks of it. Most bland and generic design you can come up with. Also, the original unique wooden entrance building is now closed off for good, and will soon be demolished

-Those metal benches, enough said.. Also, actually, the upgrade removed some benches altogether in the shelter in the middle of the platform... is Flemington really that busy of a station that you needed that extra standing space?

-New canopies look ugly. Like, really ugly. They're all metal and spiky - what was wrong with the existing wooden canopies??

[Swift]

CONS

Also, the original unique wooden entrance building is now closed off for good, and will soon be demolished

-New canopies look ugly. Like, really ugly. They're all metal and spiky - what was wrong with the existing wooden canopies??

Pity Flemington doesn't have it's own version of the Epping Civic Trust. They saved one of the magnificent 19th century station shelters, despite Epping going through a wholesale modernisation.
Why can't they do that for Flemington too?

[swtt]

CONS

Also, the original unique wooden entrance building is now closed off for good, and will soon be demolished

-New canopies look ugly. Like, really ugly. They're all metal and spiky - what was wrong with the existing wooden canopies??

Pity Flemington doesn't have it's own version of the Epping Civic Trust. They saved one of the magnificent 19th century station shelters, despite Epping going through a wholesale modernisation.
Why can't they do that for Flemington too?

errrr... was there anything worth salvaging? It was simply stuff that was run down and neglected, not necessarily of heritage value.

[Swift]

I'm going by what JJ was saying. I have no idea on their condition but he was implying that the features were historic.
I have never set foot on Flemmo Station.

[Jurassic_Joke]

errrr... was there anything worth salvaging? It was simply stuff that was run down and neglected, not necessarily of heritage value.

Well, the wooden entrance building was quite unique to Flemington. As was, this footbridge, ( http://c8.alamy.com/comp/EPC2BM/fleming ... EPC2BM.jpg ) which was nice to walk through in the open and offered some pleasant views. Both of which, have been closed off for good and are now about to be demolished. Its one thing to build a new entrance, but why can you not just keep the former in operation? Going down the same route as Newtown.

Not that the upgraded Newtown station was anything bad in the first place, functionally, I think its fantastic they added wheelchair access, dont get me wrong - but if every upgraded station from now on will just draw cues from it, from a visual viewpoint, that'll get bland really quickly.

I'm going by what JJ was saying. I have no idea on their condition but he was implying that the features were historic.
I have never set foot on Flemmo Station.

Precisely, Swift, thank you - here's a pic!

https://sites.google.com/site/files2bbao/IMG_2274c.jpg

[Tonymercury]

Background to Flemington -


http://www.environment.nsw.gov.au/herit ... ID=4801052

[Tonymercury]

Already miles better than the Gladys stuffup that was removing service information from platform signs altogether. Maybe we really will see some improvements with Andrew now in charge.

Do you really think that, other than locations for photo opportunities, any of this has anything to do with the whoever happens to be Minister?

[Jurassic_Joke]

Already miles better than the Gladys stuffup that was removing service information from platform signs altogether. Maybe we really will see some improvements with Andrew now in charge.

Do you really think that, other than locations for photo opportunities, any of this has anything to do with the whoever happens to be Minister?

Of course it does. Who do you think was responsible for starting this whole project in the first place? I'm pretty sure, for example, I know exactly why service information was removed from platform signage altogether. It was because of this stuff-up, article linked below, that made Gladys look like a right tool and she just decided to pull the plug on it altogether after that. Because if customers were actually surveyed or polled, no majority of the people would say "Platform 3" vs "Platform 3 towards Hornsby via..." is better and less confusing.

http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/sign-errors-a ... 2uhz2.html

Transport for NSW, may be doing the actual work, still doesn't change that they're basically the Minister's underlings.

[Tonymercury]

That may go down as one of the funniest posts ever made here...

Dear, oh dear!

[simonl]

Do you really think that the person at the top has no influence? Takes a while to filter down in large organisations.

[Tonymercury]

Do you really think that the person at the top has no influence? Takes a while to filter down in large organisations.

Of course I don't think that Simon, but, as in most things, the real world is far more complicated.

But this consistent attitude of 'blame/praise the minister' is a good way of ignoring how things might really be working. If you dig through the threads here you'll find a large amount of it - currently there is a version running on the ferry thread.

Its nice to look for a simplistic answer, but it rarely works.

[Mboi84]

[/quote]Do you really think that, other than locations for photo opportunities, any of this has anything to do with the whoever happens to be Minister?[/quote]

Of course it does. Who do you think was responsible for starting this whole project in the first place? I'm pretty sure, for example, I know exactly why service information was removed from platform signage altogether. It was because of this stuff-up, article linked below, that made Gladys look like a right tool and she just decided to pull the plug on it altogether after that. Because if customers were actually surveyed or polled, no majority of the people would say "Platform 3" vs "Platform 3 towards Hornsby via..." is better and less confusing.

http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/sign-errors-a ... 2uhz2.html

Transport for NSW, may be doing the actual work, still doesn't change that they're basically the Minister's underlings.[/quote]

If you ask the staff at Town Hall, they kind of miss the trial signage. Yes there was that incident that went viral but mistakes can and do happen with the tight timelines given to implement the trial signage at the time.

Personal, I did like the trial signage and think there could have been some minor tweaks made but at the end of the day, I am just a mere transport user.

Honestly I do think TfNSW need to listen to the customers more as I have found the "next station" sign a bit confusing especially if the train on the platform its on doesn't stop there (aka platform 1 at Parramatta which has the Next Station as Harris Park - to be honest, I think it has been placed there for when platform 1 does get these services that actually will stop at the next station again being Harris Park).

The only thing I have noticed its tourist who don't necessarily understand what T B F L, especially L as most countries would have T for tram and not L for light rail. I think there should be another campaign to advise what T-B-F-L stand for tourists and people from interstate or the country/regional areas.

Don't get me started on why you can only top up your OPAL card at official OPAL retailers and not station staff!! I give you a case of this elderly gentleman who had arrived the morning before hand on an XPT service from Dubbo i think it was and they weren't really told about the Opal card (they were meeting some family in Parramatta) and they weren't told about how to get an opal card and because Blacktown doesn't have a single opal ticket card machine, they were forced to go to the newsagent around the corner from the main barriers and had to buy the adult black OPAL card. They said they only come to Sydney 1 every 1-2 years or so if not at all and they wish they were advised about it and I think this is a huge issues that really should and can be solved by constance still allowing even just 1 window to remain open to sell single ticket opal cards and top up opal cards. Why this can't be given that (and as far to my knowledge) London Underground still have windows manned by LU staff to top up their Oyster cards and sell single tickets or return tickets. This is the same in the Newcastle area say in places like Maitland, Dungog, Scone, Mussellbrook etc where people say the elderly or the disabled might not live near top up places close to the station and can't top up at the station or buy single tickets.

I do believe this decision should be reviewed with feedback from customers from all over the Opal network and in regional areas, campaigns should exist to remind people to order their Opal cards before hand (either via ads in local papers/TV/radio etc.

[boronia]

If you ask the staff at Town Hall, they kind of miss the trial signage. Yes there was that incident that went viral but mistakes can and do happen with the tight timelines given to implement the trial signage at the time.

Most station staff don't really care about incorrect signage, they never seem to read it or check for correctness.. I have been pointing out errors at Central for months, including feedback, but nothing gets done.

Honestly I do think TfNSW need to listen to the customers more as I have found the "next station" sign a bit confusing especially if the train on the platform its on doesn't stop there (aka platform 1 at Parramatta which has the Next Station as Harris Park - to be honest, I think it has been placed there for when platform 1 does get these services that actually will stop at the next station again being Harris Park)

Well, it is the next station. The platform announcements and signage would advise whether it is the next STOP.

Don't get me started on why you can only top up your OPAL card at official OPAL retailers and not station staff!! I give you a case of this elderly gentleman who had arrived the morning before hand on an XPT service from Dubbo i think it was and they weren't really told about the Opal card (they were meeting some family in Parramatta) and they weren't told about how to get an opal card and because Blacktown doesn't have a single opal ticket card machine, they were forced to go to the newsagent around the corner from the main barriers and had to buy the adult black OPAL card. They said they only come to Sydney 1 every 1-2 years or so if not at all and they wish they were advised about it and I think this is a huge issues that really should and can be solved by constance still allowing even just 1 window to remain open to sell single ticket opal cards and top up opal cards. Why this can't be given that (and as far to my knowledge) London Underground still have windows manned by LU staff to top up their Oyster cards and sell single tickets or return tickets. This is the same in the Newcastle area say in places like Maitland, Dungog, Scone, Mussellbrook etc where people say the elderly or the disabled might not live near top up places close to the station and can't top up at the station or buy single tickets.

THere is something seriously wrong here if the gentleman arrived by XPT from Dubbo the previous morning, as this is an evening service. I find it hard to believe that a major station like Blacktown doesn't have a single ticket machine. If he was meeting "family", why didn't they tell him about ticketing? Did he bother to ask staff on the train about ticketing? No point in wasting money on "campaigns" if nobody takes any notice of them.

I wonder how many single tickets they would sell in a day at stations, would hardly justify paying to keep a ticket window opening.

There already is plenty of information about the transport idiosyncrasies in Sydney available. People are just too lazy to ask or find out for themselves.

[gilberations]

Information Received is that the latest issue of branding is now the standard and existing will be rolled out in force and replace all existing substandard signage.

Colour Coding is key:

Orange = Heavy Rail Station
Blue = Bus Stop/Station
Green = Ferry Wharf
Red = Light Rail Station
Aqua = Metro Station
Black over one of the above colours = Wayfinding

Bus stops will reveive the largest change. The B sign will now include Route Numbers and Service directions. Stops with a shelter will also receive wayfinding information for local streets, attractions, etc.

[swtt]

Bus stops will reveive the largest change. The B sign will now include Route Numbers and Service directions. Stops with a shelter will also receive wayfinding information for local streets, attractions, etc.

Terrific. Buses in Sydney should all be "all stops" -- all stops that it's supposed to stop at, spaced out by 400 m (suburban) and 800 m (rapid), not every bloody bus stop that is 50 m away from each other!

[simonl]

Don't get me started on why you can only top up your OPAL card at official OPAL retailers and not station staff!!

I agree with most of your post but I cannot agree with you on this one. Time for less station staff and there's no problem with having Opal cards sold by a newsagent if it is open from first to last service. What does surprise me is that Opal card dispensing machines aren't available. Qld has them at every station even ones like Bindha with 7 station entries per day IIRC! Qld uses a less advanced version of the MiFare card from the same vendor so it would be very surprising if this wasn't possible, but they wanted to save a small amount of money. BTW, they also have history viewing function in Qld on every station. I suppose NSW can't be better than Qld in every way.

[Frosty]

I don't know if anyone has noticed on the north concourse escalators at Central down to P24/25 I noticed they changed the warning stickers and some other stickers on the escalator they seem to have a different style and font compared to the old version.

[moa999]

What does surprise me is that Opal card dispensing machines aren't available. .

But why??
How many new cards would each $$$ machine sell per year. And why not bus stops as well if you really think a need exists.

For the tourist there are plenty of outlets in central areas.
Personally think they went overboard with the opal top-up/single ticket rollout as it is.

[gilberations]

What does surprise me is that Opal card dispensing machines aren't available. .

But why??
How many new cards would each $$$ machine sell per year. And why not bus stops as well if you really think a need exists.

For the tourist there are plenty of outlets in central areas.
Personally think they went overboard with the opal top-up/single ticket rollout as it is.

You are joking aren't you?

Take Central Station for example. There are 4 opal machines. 4. With a que of about 30 people at them!

[simonl]

Additionally, in response to the why, it would provide further encouragement to get off the single trip concept.

As for buses, pay pass payment isn't too far off. The is a huge need to stop people from paying with cash.

[simonl]

Stupid that you can't top up online for $10 but can at a machine. For an adult card.

[moa999]

You are joking aren't you?
Take Central Station for example. There are 4 opal machines. 4. With a que of about 30 people at them!

Nope. The vast majority of Opal users NEVER user a ticket machine, or a retail outlet.
A bunch of others top up at retailers only (including at a certain supermarket chain where there are other benefits given)
Bus users generally utilise these methods, no reason why train users can't.

I'm always amused when there is a queue at the machines, particularly when there is also often a retailer nearby (including the Newslinks, Minimart and Customer Service centres) at Central