Opal Discussion and Observations

Sydney / New South Wales Transport Discussion
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boronia
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Re: Introducing OPAL Card

Post by boronia »

I may have missed something, but this trial on ferries seems to be OK if you only travel on ferries. What happens if you need to use a bus at either or both ends of your ferry trip? Will someone with a my multi type ticket be given a free Opal card to use for the ferry segment?
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Kliamet
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Re: Introducing OPAL Card

Post by Kliamet »

Boxythingy, you missed the weather channel logo as well
moa999
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Re: Introducing OPAL Card

Post by moa999 »

Interesting point boronia.
I suspect if you are presently using a MyMulti ticket you are better off continuing to use just it - otherwise you will pay for the MyMulti, and also pay for the Ferry.

MyMulti 1 - $43.00
MyFerry1 10 - $44.80
MyFerry2 10 - $56.00
Opal Ferry1 - $44.80 (cap at 8 trips)
Opal Ferry 2 - $56.00 (cap at 8 trips)

Indeed as shown by the above, all weekday ferry travellers are still better off buying the MyMulti1
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Simes
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Re: Introducing OPAL Card

Post by Simes »

Fleet Lists wrote:Totally irrelevant.

Just because there is a Sunday $2.50 cap does not mean that pensioners will still pay $2.50 on other days.

Under the Opal system they can can come up with all sorts of other combinations some of which we probably have never thought of. We can start all sorts of rumours about these things but only time will tell what will actually happen.
Going off the video, there seemed to be an older guy with a card that seemed to have a gold tinge to it - so maybe they'll have their own card?
http://19302413.blogspot.com/

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moa999
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Re: Introducing OPAL Card

Post by moa999 »

Video shows Gold for Pensioner/Senior Citizen, and Grey for Student/Concession.
Also mentioned that there will be Blue/Green cards in one of the releases.

boronia makes a good point.

I suspect anyone using multi-modal is still better off buying the MyMulti1 fares, as otherwise they are effectively paying twice for the ferry trip, still having to purchase the MyMulti1

Indeed with the current pricing the 8-fare cap maximum is the same price as the current MyFerry1 and MyFerry2 respectively
The MyMulti1 is still cheaper.
Thus still better off for daily users to buy the MyMulti1 rather than use the Opal Card.

Hence the most frequent users, shouldn't use the Opal card in the initial trial...
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chuppa
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Re: Introducing OPAL Card

Post by chuppa »

Simes wrote:
Fleet Lists wrote:Totally irrelevant.

Just because there is a Sunday $2.50 cap does not mean that pensioners will still pay $2.50 on other days.

Under the Opal system they can can come up with all sorts of other combinations some of which we probably have never thought of. We can start all sorts of rumours about these things but only time will tell what will actually happen.
Going off the video, there seemed to be an older guy with a card that seemed to have a gold tinge to it - so maybe they'll have their own card?
From http://www.smh.com.au/it-pro/government ... 2a16k.html
Unfortunately, concession cards – in grey, gold, green and blue – will not be available until some time next year.
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Tim
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Re: Introducing OPAL Card

Post by Tim »

Simes wrote:
Fleet Lists wrote:Totally irrelevant.

Just because there is a Sunday $2.50 cap does not mean that pensioners will still pay $2.50 on other days.

Under the Opal system they can can come up with all sorts of other combinations some of which we probably have never thought of. We can start all sorts of rumours about these things but only time will tell what will actually happen.
Going off the video, there seemed to be an older guy with a card that seemed to have a gold tinge to it - so maybe they'll have their own card?
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R44
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Re: Introducing OPAL Card

Post by R44 »

boxythingy wrote:
CityRail wrote:$15.00 Cap on Mondays - Saturdays is way too expensive, but it is still a $6.00 discount from MyMulti Daily.
It will still being quite expensive for those who will have an extra trip to somewhere else.
Remember, $20.50 for an Adult MyMulti Daypass.
$21 - Double that of the $10.50 Student variant.
iDionz
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Re: Introducing OPAL Card

Post by iDionz »

moa999 wrote:Interesting point boronia.
I suspect if you are presently using a MyMulti ticket you are better off continuing to use just it - otherwise you will pay for the MyMulti, and also pay for the Ferry.

MyMulti 1 - $43.00
MyFerry1 10 - $44.80
MyFerry2 10 - $56.00
Opal Ferry1 - $44.80 (cap at 8 trips)
Opal Ferry 2 - $56.00 (cap at 8 trips)

Indeed as shown by the above, all weekday ferry travellers are still better off buying the MyMulti1
What is more interesting is what happens if the service has to be replaced by a bus! Can't use opal on a bus yet
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Re: Introducing OPAL Card

Post by 745-Castle Hill »

Yes, track work will be interesting on trains when you don't have opal for the bus yet in 2013/4
simonl
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Re: Introducing OPAL Card

Post by simonl »

Fleet Lists wrote:Just because there is a Sunday $2.50 cap does not mean that pensioners will still pay $2.50 on other days.
Agreed.

However, I find it very unlikely that the Pensioner ET will be removed. That would be so politically dangerous I can't imagine any government trying it.
kypros1992
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Re: Introducing OPAL Card

Post by kypros1992 »

Some releases today:

http://www.transport.nsw.gov.au/sites/d ... 0trial.pdf - Media Release

http://www.transport.nsw.gov.au/sites/d ... eet%20.pdf - Fact Sheet

http://www.transport.nsw.gov.au/sites/d ... images.pdf - Opal Card images
For the Neutral Bay ferry trial, Opal’s adult fares are set at the equivalent MyZone single fare.
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Simes
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Re: Introducing OPAL Card

Post by Simes »

iDionz wrote:
moa999 wrote:Interesting point boronia.
I suspect if you are presently using a MyMulti ticket you are better off continuing to use just it - otherwise you will pay for the MyMulti, and also pay for the Ferry.

MyMulti 1 - $43.00
MyFerry1 10 - $44.80
MyFerry2 10 - $56.00
Opal Ferry1 - $44.80 (cap at 8 trips)
Opal Ferry 2 - $56.00 (cap at 8 trips)

Indeed as shown by the above, all weekday ferry travellers are still better off buying the MyMulti1
What is more interesting is what happens if the service has to be replaced by a bus! Can't use opal on a bus yet
745-Castle Hill wrote:Yes, track work will be interesting on trains when you don't have opal for the bus yet in 2013/4
Ummmm I think it will be more comical when you can :P
http://19302413.blogspot.com/

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moa999
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Re: Introducing OPAL Card

Post by moa999 »

Trackwork will probably be just the same as before
- the ticket doesn't get scanned

ie. On Opal you wont get charged...

Very interested that all of ferries won't be done until end of next year (ie end 2013),
whereas some of Cityrail cuts in mid-2013.
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Simes
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Re: Introducing OPAL Card

Post by Simes »

That's not how it works in Melbourne - since the metcard days, tram or train replaced, you buy your ticket off the driver

I'd imagine they would use opal to firstly catch out the people missed (despite all the signs about traveling with a ticket, I bet not many do, I'll admit I haven't in the past - just waited til I got to where the trains were running)
Also it would no doubt be used for stats on numbers using the buses
http://19302413.blogspot.com/

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simonl
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Re: Introducing OPAL Card

Post by simonl »

moa999 wrote:Opal Ferry1 - $44.80 (cap at 8 trips)
Opal Ferry 2 - $56.00 (cap at 8 trips)
Do you have a source for these fares, or are you assuming them?
kypros1992
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Re: Introducing OPAL Card

Post by kypros1992 »

Isn't it just 80% of the MyFerry1 TravelTen?

Why would the Opal fare be more??
Kliamet
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Re: Introducing OPAL Card

Post by Kliamet »

The TfNSW Opal site says that CityRail will start with city circle so I suspect that trial will be designed for ferry customers that transfer to trains since not that many people only use the city circle. But I assume that they're saying "trains" rather than CityRail because it will be changed to Sydney Trains/ NSW Trains by then.... I wonder if they'll eventually extend opal to the manly fast ferry company seeing as they are government contracted and sydney ferries (or harbour city ferries) is franchised now anyway. It would mean some sort of infrastructure allowances to tell the difference but I'm sure they could something out.
moa999
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Re: Introducing OPAL Card

Post by moa999 »

simonl wrote:
moa999 wrote:Opal Ferry1 - $44.80 (cap at 8 trips)
Opal Ferry 2 - $56.00 (cap at 8 trips)
Do you have a source for these fares, or are you assuming them?
Releases say Opal fares are unchanged from current.
So have just taken the prices for MyFerry1 single Adult - $5.60, and MyFerry 2 single Adult - $7.00.
Interestingly the 8-cap ends up being the same as the TravelTen
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swtt
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Re: Introducing OPAL Card

Post by swtt »

moa999 wrote: Interestingly the 8-cap ends up being the same as the TravelTen
That's why when MyZone came in, the T10 discounts went from 25% to 20% :)
OKO
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Re: Introducing OPAL Card

Post by OKO »

abesty wrote:Interesting:
Opal Terms of Use wrote: 28. For ferry services to and from Manly only, you must tap on at the beginning of your trip but you do not have to tap off at the end of your trip and you may exit without doing so
Wonder why.
http://www.transport.nsw.gov.au/opal/terms-of-use

The Call Centre will be 13 67 25 (13 OPAL).
Maybe because there are no stops where you may disembark mid trip.
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R44
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Re: Introducing OPAL Card

Post by R44 »

OKO wrote: Maybe because there are no stops where you may disembark mid trip.
Same was stated on RP. It's a single fare line, So it makes sense.
moa999
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Re: Introducing OPAL Card

Post by moa999 »

While I understand Manly being a direct service, I still hope the "Tag On, Tag Off" message is rammed home, otherwise there will be mass confusion.

Also be somewhat weird for the system to work out people transferring ferry-train (when train is activated)
TagOn Manly Wharf
TagOn Circ Quay Stn
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boronia
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Re: Introducing OPAL Card

Post by boronia »

With Myki in melbourne, you only need to tag on on a tram, although you can tag off. The system can detect if the next tag is on the same vehicle (a tag off) or another vehicle (a new tag on).

It is better not to have exceptions to avoid confusion, but with the sheer numbers on a Manly Ferry, delays if eveyone had to tag off would be enormous.
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Re: Introducing OPAL Card

Post by CityRail »

Kliamet wrote:The TfNSW Opal site says that CityRail will start with city circle so I suspect that trial will be designed for ferry customers that transfer to trains since not that many people only use the city circle. But I assume that they're saying "trains" rather than CityRail because it will be changed to Sydney Trains/ NSW Trains by then.... I wonder if they'll eventually extend opal to the manly fast ferry company seeing as they are government contracted and sydney ferries (or harbour city ferries) is franchised now anyway. It would mean some sort of infrastructure allowances to tell the difference but I'm sure they could something out.
The Government of New South Wales perhaps still cannot get out from their wrong think path where passengers will only use public transport to/from work and they will use their own car on the weekends so their trips will be regular etc. Note once the trial has started on trains (on the City Circle) the ferry trial will be finished and Opal will be available on Ferries.

If they are just trial on the City Circle, I think a lot of passengers will start buying Opals and travel on the rail network for free since you cannot identify whether the passenger is on a possession of a valid ticket or not outside the City. Or how about a passenger need to travel by Ferry and to work at Kings Cross or go to Uni at Redfern?
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