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NSW Future Rail Plan - NWRL/Metro/Harbour Crossing

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NSW Future Rail Plan - NWRL/Metro/Harbour Crossing

Postby kypros1992 » Wed Jun 20, 2012 2:11 pm

EDIT

Video: http://youtu.be/hNlkP8_oTIE

Media Release: http://northwestrail.com.au/document/show/72

Report: http://haveyoursay.nsw.gov.au/document/show/328



Single deck metro-style trains will be introduced to the Sydney rail network and the new North West Rail Link will be privately operated under a major shake-up announced by the NSW Government.
The government's 20-year plan for the rail network includes planning for a second harbour crossing and promises to deliver more frequent services and increased train capacity.
Key to the new plan are so-called "rapid transit trains" - single deck metro-style carriages that will operate on the yet to be built North West Rail Link, and be introduced on the Bankstown Line and on the Illawarra Line between the CBD and Hurstville.

The new rapid transit system will see more frequent services on those lines, and will result in a 60 per cent increase in the number of trains that run into the CBD and increase capacity to west and southwest Sydney, Premier Barry O'Farrell says.
"Train travellers have told us they want more frequent services and increased train capacity and that's what they will get," Mr O'Farrell said today.
"This is a long-term transformation of our rail network - introducing rapid transit to the system to deliver major increases in capacity and frequency for greater Sydney."
NSW Transport Minister Gladys Berejiklian said the North West Rail Link would be privately operated, with non-timetabled services running every five minutes between Rouse Hill and Chatswood, where passengers would have to change for trains into the CBD.
"The trains operating on the North West Rail Link will be a new generation, single deck service - delivering a fast, safe and reliable journey for commuters," Ms Berejiklian said.
"There will be no need for a timetable - customers will just turn up to one of the eight new stations proposed for the northwest and catch the next train."
She said boring machines would begin work on the North West Rail Link in 2014, with expressions of interest for the construction contract to be called for later this month.
The line is expected to take between five and six years to completed.
Ms Berejiklian would not set a timeframe for the building of the second harbour crossing.
The second crossing would be constructed under the harbour, the Transport Minister said.
Ms Berejiklian said the 20-year rail strategy, which is part of the draft Transport Master plan to be released later in the year, also included timetable changes which would contribute to a 60 per cent increase in services across all parts of the network.
"The plan addressed bottlenecks that severely limit the number of trains that can travel into the CBD from the north, west and south during peak periods, meaning more trains per hour for people right across the network and faster trips for intercity customers," she said.


Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/sydney-transp ... z1yIt03yme
Last edited by kypros1992 on Wed Jun 20, 2012 2:34 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: BREAKING: NWRL Private | Metro Trains | Harbour Crossing

Postby simonl » Wed Jun 20, 2012 2:14 pm

In the words of "Men in Suits": "At least we're not in Sydney, where it's totally f....d"
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Re: BREAKING: NWRL Private | Metro Trains | Harbour Crossing

Postby kypros1992 » Wed Jun 20, 2012 2:17 pm

simonl wrote:In the words of "Men in Suits": "At least we're not in Sydney, where it's totally f....d"


NWRL being private was bound to happen, did the govt. really think they could afford it? Maybe now they can build the PERL with the federal money and keep everyone happy (but the north west)
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Re: BREAKING: NWRL Private | Metro Trains | Harbour Crossing

Postby simonl » Wed Jun 20, 2012 2:22 pm

People in the NW would have voted Liberal anyway so I don't see why they bothered.
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Re: NSW Future Rail Plan - NWRL/Metro/Harbour Crossing

Postby Glen » Wed Jun 20, 2012 3:16 pm

Rouse Hill to Chatswood then change trains for the City. Oh dear.

Onto what ? Already full North Shore trains?

Don't take out my M2 bus route yet!
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Re: NSW Future Rail Plan - NWRL/Metro/Harbour Crossing

Postby deepthought2006 » Wed Jun 20, 2012 3:27 pm

In the words of Sir Humprey Appleby: "That is a very brave decision, Minister".
All opinions expressed are my own.
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Re: NSW Future Rail Plan - NWRL/Metro/Harbour Crossing

Postby Glen » Wed Jun 20, 2012 3:27 pm

There is an interesting diagram on page 7 of that report which shows 7 trains per hour crossing from the Up Main to the Up Suburban at Illawarra Junction, to make 19 trains per hour into the City (Central platform 16). If they were smarter in their scheduling they’d realise that all 19 trains could already fit on the Up Suburban line all the way, and do the crossings at Homebush where virtually every train makes a parallel movement Main to Suburban and Suburban to Local, so removing all of the conflicting movements at Illawarra Junction.
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Re: NSW Future Rail Plan - NWRL/Metro/Harbour Crossing

Postby boxythingy » Wed Jun 20, 2012 3:42 pm

Australia brags about its political system, but their PM says one thing during the election; something else when (s)he takes office, something else at midterm and something else when (s)he leaves.
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Re: NSW Future Rail Plan - NWRL/Metro/Harbour Crossing

Postby simonl » Wed Jun 20, 2012 3:52 pm

deepthought2006 wrote:In the words of Sir Humprey Appleby: "That is a very brave decision, Minister".

Brave = lose votes
Courageous = lose election

Does Very brave = maybe lose election?
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Re: NSW Future Rail Plan - NWRL/Metro/Harbour Crossing

Postby Fleet Lists » Wed Jun 20, 2012 4:15 pm

I am not impressed with this but I think their majority is big enough so that they can afford to lose some seats in the NW area which basically are Liberal anyway so they are not as likely to lose them as if it was in the south west.

So promise fulfilled but not in a very satisfactory way.
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Re: NSW Future Rail Plan - NWRL/Metro/Harbour Crossing

Postby simonl » Wed Jun 20, 2012 4:17 pm

I guess this means odds on that the upper Northern line will go to Sydney Terminal. They can't return to their former pattern because Western Line trains have taken their paths.
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Re: NSW Future Rail Plan - NWRL/Metro/Harbour Crossing

Postby abesty » Wed Jun 20, 2012 5:41 pm

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Re: NSW Future Rail Plan - NWRL/Metro/Harbour Crossing

Postby mubd » Wed Jun 20, 2012 5:58 pm

Oh dear...I thought they "promised" to build the NWRL with double deck trains in mind. The main argument they're using is that 3x metro trains rather than 1 double deck train in a given time period is better, but why can't they run 3 double decker trains?
Eastgardens to Kingsford is a 1-2 section fare.
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Re: NSW Future Rail Plan - NWRL/Metro/Harbour Crossing

Postby Volvo Super Olympian » Wed Jun 20, 2012 6:09 pm

Single deck trains are good for short distances, they clearly have no idea what all is about.
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Re: NSW Future Rail Plan - NWRL/Metro/Harbour Crossing

Postby boxythingy » Wed Jun 20, 2012 6:25 pm

mubd wrote:Oh dear...I thought they "promised" to build the NWRL with double deck trains in mind. The main argument they're using is that 3x metro trains rather than 1 double deck train in a given time period is better, but why can't they run 3 double decker trains?

Metro style trains can be boarded more quickly, although I see nothing wrong with double deckers if people just move right straight into the vestibule to stand, or if they want to have a seat, move quickly up/downstairs and sit in the first spot they see, rather than step onto the train, have a look around and hold up the people still on the platform. :evil:
Last edited by boxythingy on Wed Jun 20, 2012 6:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: NSW Future Rail Plan - NWRL/Metro/Harbour Crossing

Postby abesty » Wed Jun 20, 2012 6:31 pm

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Re: NSW Future Rail Plan - NWRL/Metro/Harbour Crossing

Postby boxythingy » Wed Jun 20, 2012 6:47 pm

Australia brags about its political system, but their PM says one thing during the election; something else when (s)he takes office, something else at midterm and something else when (s)he leaves.
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Re: NSW Future Rail Plan - NWRL/Metro/Harbour Crossing

Postby AndrewCowley » Wed Jun 20, 2012 6:51 pm

Surely even if its configured with a change at Chatswood then its still a huge improvement on the current joke with buses into the city from the NW?

Wouldn't the 2nd harbour crossing provide extra capacity such that you wouldn't be forcing people onto already crowded North Shore trains?

It does seem that the decision is primarily because of the NWRL being private and that's not ideal perhaps. But surely it's still overwhelmingly positive?
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Re: NSW Future Rail Plan - NWRL/Metro/Harbour Crossing

Postby boxythingy » Wed Jun 20, 2012 7:03 pm

As I see it, it's failed in providing a both 'direct AND faster' service into the city (unless many NW residents already change for another bus into the City).

On top of this missing directness is the EXTRA cost that passengers will forced be to pay until the second harbour crossing is completed, and even then will the corporations still be greedy enough to cash in in the Public Private 'Partnership'? Yes.

IF only the second harbour crossing was built, we probably wouldn't be in this mess now. CityFail
Last edited by boxythingy on Wed Jun 20, 2012 7:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: NSW Future Rail Plan - NWRL/Metro/Harbour Crossing

Postby AndrewCowley » Wed Jun 20, 2012 7:08 pm

What is the estimated travel time? Hard to imagine it not being better than the current bus situation. Stationary buses on the Harbour Bridge is literally as slow as you can go!
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Re: NSW Future Rail Plan - NWRL/Metro/Harbour Crossing

Postby swtt » Wed Jun 20, 2012 7:14 pm

ZZZzZZZZZzzz. Another day, another plan. By another media obsessed government.

Can we bring Morris Iemma back as premier? At least with his NWM plan there would've been more locations not served by rail, that would be served by the NWM.

This is a bastardised version of the NWM that Iemma proposed.
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Re: NSW Future Rail Plan - NWRL/Metro/Harbour Crossing

Postby AndrewCowley » Wed Jun 20, 2012 7:24 pm

Harsh. Give them a chance. This is not the other mob after all. Why isn't it as simple as this -

Build the NW rail link now. Make it terminate at Chatswood and even in that configuration it offers relief.

Later on the 2nd harbour crossing will come and then through services can be considered.

I can see how you guys get hung up on the whole heavy rail vs metro argument. But it's all about building tracks, expanding the network and ultimately moving people more efficiently.
Last edited by AndrewCowley on Wed Jun 20, 2012 8:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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It's a very safe seat, it won't be built for a LONG TIME yet

Postby Newcastle Flyer » Wed Jun 20, 2012 7:35 pm

boxythingy wrote:As I see it, it's failed in providing a both 'direct AND faster' service into the city (unless many NW residents already change for another bus into the City).
But couldn't they easily terminate them & start them at North Sydney, and then transfer to buses to the Sydney CBD? :mrgreen:

She said boring machines would begin work on the North West Rail Link in 2014
Hmm, Keyword 2014! Isn't that after. . .

Call me cyncical, but: I will believeith it when I seeith it!
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Re: NSW Future Rail Plan - NWRL/Metro/Harbour Crossing

Postby deepthought2006 » Wed Jun 20, 2012 9:05 pm

AndrewCowley wrote:Surely even if its configured with a change at Chatswood then its still a huge improvement on the current joke with buses into the city from the NW?

There's the problem - what is being proposed for the foreseeable future is a limited shuttle service with the need to change trains at Chatswood, already probably the busiest station north of North Sydney.

IF (and it's a big if, too, in my opinion) the 3-min North Shore Line headways mentioned can be attained, from Chatswood to the City, then just maybe it can help reduce the numbers of people using the buses over the bridge. Otherwise, the effect on the buses over the Bridge and into the CBD will be minimal. How do you spell "wh_te e-eph--t"?
AndrewCowley wrote:Wouldn't the 2nd harbour crossing provide extra capacity such that you wouldn't be forcing people onto already crowded North Shore trains?

People don't like to get out of their comfy, hard-fought-for seat and have to wait on cold/hot and drafty station platforms for trains that might never come. Well, not as immediately as they would like. As I said, I need to be convinced that a 3 minute headway is possible, particularly with the North Sydney and Wynyard congestion and waiting trains, as many of the passengers get off and on the trains up ahead. Even with the theoretical dwell-time advantages of multiple door metro-style single deckers.
AndrewCowley wrote:It does seem that the decision is primarily because of the NWRL being private and that's not ideal perhaps. But surely it's still overwhelmingly positive?
Is it really better than nothing, if it means spending millions on something that is going to be ineffective and probably under-utilised in the short term for the majority of Gladys' darling "customers"? And just how long-term is that "short term" likely to be, before we get the second harbour crossing, hmmm? Cynical? Who, me????? Never!

Gladys, stake your career on it. Promise to resign (from parliament, as a politician with integrity) if the second harbour crossing is not completed within, say, two terms!
All opinions expressed are my own.
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Re: NSW Future Rail Plan - NWRL/Metro/Harbour Crossing

Postby Newcastle Flyer » Wed Jun 20, 2012 9:37 pm

deepthought2006 wrote:Gladys, stake your career on it. Promise to resign (from parliament, as a politician with integrity) if the second harbour crossing is not completed within, say, two terms!
You should say transport minister of this government, just in case the current NSW "government" (getting more like dictators) change transport ministers.

Anyone get the feeling that like former Premier KK, that Gladys is a puppet? Would she even know what the First Fleet are or the type of trains that do interurban runs?
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