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Sydney airport traffic chaos

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Re: Sydney airport traffic chaos

Postby Swift » Sat Aug 19, 2017 5:35 pm

Really only useful for the original reason stated here, if the 400 was stuck in gridlock on the way to the airport from the Bondi Jcn direction.
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Re: Sydney airport traffic chaos

Postby Roderick Smith » Mon Sep 04, 2017 10:52 am

September 4 2017 Double toll looms as Lendlease bids to build motorway to Sydney Airport .
Motorists face paying two sets of tolls to drive from western parts of Sydney to the city's main airport as property and construction giant Lendlease seeks the rights to build a crucial motorway link from the WestConnex toll road to both the airport and port.
Lendlease, which is riding a construction boom in NSW, has lodged an unsolicited proposal with the state government for the so-called Sydney gateway, extending from a major interchange for WestConnex at St Peters in Sydney's inner west to Mascot.
More videos Sydney tops nation's transport costs A report by the Australian Automobile Association reveals the average family from western Sydney is paying around $22,000 a year in transport costs.
While few details of the link's likely final shape have been released, the government says the gateway will not be part of the distance-based tolling regime for WestConnex, which is capped at $8.60 in today's dollars.
That means motorists driving from parts of western Sydney such as Parramatta to the airport face paying well above the toll cap if separate charges are imposed on the gateway.
The Berejiklian government has been under pressure to reveal its intentions for the gateway because it was one of the original justifications for the 33-kilometre WestConnex tollroad.
The Minister for WestConnex, Stuart Ayres, and the Roads Minister, Melinda Pavey, will be grilled about the gateway when they appear before budget estimates hearings on Wednesday.
Labor's transport spokeswoman, Jodi McKay, said the government needed to reveal what the tolling regime would be for the gateway, given it had made clear it was now not part of WestConnex.
"There are real questions that the government has to answer about how much it is going to cost people in western Sydney to get to the airport, and whether they will be tolled twice," she said. "There is so much secrecy around this whole thing."
The gateway will connect to the interchange for WestConnex at St Peters.
A spokesman for Mrs Pavey declined to answer questions about what tolls would be imposed on the gateway, but reiterated that it would not be part of the tolling regime for WestConnex and that the government was working with key stakeholders on a design concept.
"Unlike Labor, we are committed to delivering key infrastructure projects like Sydney gateway that will connect to WestConnex by 2023," he said.
The so-called Sydney gateway was listed as part of the second stage of WestConnex in the business case.
Lendlease, which declined to comment, boasts among its senior ranks Jason de Sousa, an ex-chief of staff to former NSW roads minister Duncan Gay.
Christopher Swann, a former Macquarie Bank executive who managed the second stage of WestConnex, has also been at the Lendlease-owned infrastructure financier Capella Capital since February.
The gateway to the airport falls under the management of NSW Roads and Maritime Services, which has been conducting extensive modelling of traffic for the proposed link.
The roads authority has refused Fairfax Media's request under freedom-of-information laws for access to the traffic modelling and other reports about the gateway.
The gateway link has been complicated by the large number of federal and government agencies, and companies such as Sydney Airport and Qube, which are affected by its development.
Construction of the gateway is planned to dovetail with the proposed duplication of the rail line from Port Botany to Sydney's west. That may require moving the rail line near the northern boundary of the airport about 500 metres north.
A Transport for NSW document obtained last month by Labor estimated that the cost of the link to the port and airport had more than doubled to as much as $1.8 billion.
The updated business case for WestConnex, released in late 2015, lists the gateway as part of stage two of the project, and due to open "at the latest" by 2023.
Yet the government insists it is not part of WestConnex, and that the $800 million for the gateway included in the total cost of the $16.8 billion toll road project was an "allocation".
A Lendlease consortium is also one of two groups the state government shortlisted in June to build the final stage of WestConnex, which comprises twin tunnels between Haberfield and St Peters known as the M4-M5 link.
Lendlease is involved in constructing the nine-kilometre NorthConnex tunnel linking the M1 motorway to the M2 in Sydney's north, and major road upgrades near the site of the proposed Western Sydney Airport at Badgerys Creek.
Related Articles:
$1 billion blowout in Westconnex gateway project .
The 'logical' plan for WestConnex's link to Sydney Airport .
http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/double-toll-l ... y9nk8.html
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Re: Sydney airport

Postby Roderick Smith » Sun Dec 03, 2017 6:07 pm

Roderick.

HARD LANDING
After enduring what was definitely the worst arrival experience I've ever had at Sydney International Airport recently, I realised how some proven ideas could fix a lot of problems there.
Ample clear signs in a few languages to direct passengers towards immigration, transit, toilets and for the duty-free collection desk wouldn't go astray. A yellow line around each baggage carousel with a graphic explaining to remain behind the line.
A big clear digital display over the centre of each carousel to show the arriving flight number and directions for proceeding through customs in a few different languages and repetitive, clear and audible recorded messages in a few languages to explain and direct the arrival process.
A system to channel passengers through the customs entry rather than the free for all push-in lines that currently develop. Custom agents who can direct foreign visitors to the numbered customs desks in a few languages (it wouldn't be difficult to learn numbers one to six in a few languages) or hold up an easy to read numbered card and point in the appropriate direction.
These ideas are standard in the best airports around the world. The departure experience at Sydney Airport isn't too bad – the current arrival experience can be a nightmare.
www.traveller.com.au/reader-feedback-ra ... ves-gztd88
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Re: Sydney airport traffic chaos

Postby Liamena » Tue Dec 05, 2017 11:01 pm

I flew into Sydney today and the airport was deserted.

They still managed to put baggage from one plane onto two different carousels at opposite ends of the building, And none of the security people wandering around seemed to notice that, despite the place being otherwise deserted, there were about 30 people still waiting at a carousel with no bags on it or coming onto it.

I ignored the safety fences trying to divert pedestrians to the bus stop through a 400 meter unnecessary detour, and I noticed lots of other people doing that, also.

Meanwhile the 400 was so full, people could not get onto it.

And the driver was an incompetent, who kept taking his foot off the brake and then stomping on it when the bus started rolling. Causing people to fall over. Repeatedly.

And the green arrow at the turnoff from the Princes Highway to Banksia station is broken.
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Re: Sydney airport

Postby Tonymercury » Wed Dec 06, 2017 9:46 am

Roderick Smith wrote:R
HARD LANDING
After enduring what was definitely the worst arrival experience I've ever had at Sydney International Airport recently, I realised how some proven ideas could fix a lot of problems there.


And lots more...


Someone actually wants SAC to dip into its profit stream to pay for improvements?

We'd be more likely to see a supplement for faster arrival.
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Re: Sydney airport traffic chaos

Postby tonyp » Wed Dec 06, 2017 10:08 am

Liamena wrote:
Meanwhile the 400 was so full, people could not get onto it.

TfNSW/STA don't do mass transit. Take the train or drive your car.
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Re: Sydney airport traffic chaos

Postby boronia » Wed Dec 06, 2017 11:27 am

Most of the passengers getting on the 400 there will get off at Mascot or Rockdale to catch the train
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Re: Sydney airport traffic chaos

Postby GazzaOak » Wed Dec 06, 2017 12:14 pm

That complaint is stupid. Sydney airport isn't that bad.... sure could be improved.... just avoid the early morning the rest is fine
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Re: Sydney airport traffic chaos

Postby Liamena » Wed Dec 06, 2017 9:32 pm

boronia wrote:Most of the passengers getting on the 400 there will get off at Mascot or Rockdale to catch the train


Well the bus I caught from the Airport to Banksia, about 25 people got on at the Airport, 4 got off at Banksia. So the bus was still full, after that. There were 18 people standing on the bus, it was full. Quite a few of the passengers appeared to be construction workers with fluoro green shirts. Or maybe baggage handlers. A couple of people were left behind.

You'd be a bit silly going to Rockdale, the services there are no better than Banksia, these days, and it is also a $3.50 fare from the airport whereas Banksia is $2.15.
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Re: Sydney airport traffic chaos

Postby Swift » Thu Dec 07, 2017 4:16 am

Just screaming for high capacity bendy buses. One shopping centre prevents it.
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Re: Sydney airport traffic chaos

Postby Frosty » Thu Dec 07, 2017 6:20 am

I think people would prefer a 15 min frequency off peak west of Eastgardens over bendy Buses. Maybe introduce bendy Buses once frequency gets up past every 10 mins.

Well the worse times I’ve noticed to fly in and out of Sydney Airport is international (weekends) while domestic it’s Sunday nights & Friday afternooon.
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Re: Sydney airport traffic chaos

Postby Swift » Thu Dec 07, 2017 6:26 am

Save on driver wages and achieve the same goal by simply upgrading some to bendy. No VSTs under any circumstances.
Last edited by Swift on Thu Dec 07, 2017 6:30 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Sydney airport traffic chaos

Postby tonyp » Thu Dec 07, 2017 6:28 am

Liamena wrote: There were 18 people standing on the [12 metre?] bus, it was full.

That's not a full bus, nowhere near it. As I said, STA doesn't do mass transit. It half-fills buses and drives off. STA is a glorified limo service.
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Re: Sydney airport traffic chaos

Postby Swift » Thu Dec 07, 2017 6:33 am

^VSTMs I meant.

tonyp wrote: STA is a glorified limo service.

Your kidding right? have you experienced the ride (lack of) quality on their VSTs? Not remotely coach, let alone limo like. Actually, their Volvo versions are very good. Crapnia? Forget it.
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Re: Sydney airport traffic chaos

Postby tonyp » Thu Dec 07, 2017 9:46 am

Swift wrote:Your kidding right? have you experienced the ride (lack of) quality on their VSTs? Not remotely coach, let alone limo like. Actually, their Volvo versions are very good. Crapnia? Forget it.

I was referring to limos by size, not comfort!

Remember when the first STA Mercs arrived and the publicity was that you should take a ride in a chauffeur-driven Mercedes!
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Re: Sydney airport traffic chaos

Postby Liamena » Thu Dec 07, 2017 11:57 am

Swift wrote:Save on driver wages and achieve the same goal by simply upgrading some to bendy. No VSTs under any circumstances.


I disagree. From the passengers' point of view, more frequent buses are obviously better than bigger buses because the average waiting time is reduced. More frequent buses reduces the number of passengers crowded at the stops waiting for each service, and reduced the dwell time. More frequent buses also reduces the impact of one service going "missing in action" and the consequential unacceptable 45 minute gaps between services which seem to occur often in my experience on trips too and from the airport even at quiet off-peak times.

Twenty-minute frequency ( with some odd 25 minute and 30 minute gaps at odd times during the day ) is not all that good to begin with. Improve that first before worrying too much about larger buses.

I keep seeing claims that the 400 is Sydney's largest bus service, compared to Bondi Road or Neutral Bay or Rozelle that claim seems slightly ridiculous to me.
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Re: Sydney airport traffic chaos

Postby tonyp » Thu Dec 07, 2017 12:35 pm

Liamena wrote:I keep seeing claims that the 400 is Sydney's largest bus service, compared to Bondi Road or Neutral Bay or Rozelle that claim seems slightly ridiculous to me.

That came in a press release last year about patronage figures calculated from Opal, The 400 is supposed to have the highest patronage of any single bus route in Sydney. (In NSW they never tell you the actual patronage figure though!)

However it's a very long route. If you look at routes on a patronage per km basis, there's no doubt routes on corridors like Bondi Rd would have higher patronage per km than 400.
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Re: Sydney airport traffic chaos

Postby Fleet Lists » Thu Dec 07, 2017 1:22 pm

this seems a bit like the discussion you are having about the busiest bus route in Melbourne,
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Re: Sydney airport traffic chaos

Postby tonyp » Thu Dec 07, 2017 2:40 pm

Fleet Lists wrote:this seems a bit like the discussion you are having about the busiest bus route in Melbourne,

Yes, it is part of that discussion which is scattered over every state. I was hoping it would be possible to do a national patronage per km comparison, but only Victoria and to a lesser extent SA, have annual patronage figures for each route. The only route in NSW that we have an annual patronage figure for afaik is Wollongong 55 and that only came from political exposure.
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Re: Sydney airport traffic chaos

Postby Tonymercury » Thu Dec 07, 2017 2:55 pm

tonyp wrote:However it's a very long route. If you look at routes on a patronage per km basis, there's no doubt routes on corridors like Bondi Rd would have higher patronage per km than 400.


Not necessarily - you can have a big passenger turnover by Randwick, another by UNSW, another at Kingsford, another at MarouBra and a lot off at Eastgardens.

Remember that only a relatively small number of services go beyond Eastgardens and some of these are 410s.
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Re: Sydney airport traffic chaos

Postby boronia » Thu Dec 07, 2017 8:14 pm

Even beyond Eastgardens, there would be four or five separate corridors.
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Re: Sydney airport traffic chaos

Postby Liamena » Thu Dec 07, 2017 10:49 pm

tonyp wrote:
Liamena wrote: There were 18 people standing on the [12 metre?] bus, it was full.

That's not a full bus, nowhere near it. As I said, STA doesn't do mass transit. It half-fills buses and drives off. STA is a glorified limo service.


There were people standing all the way to the back of the bus, which was one of the short ones. There were four or five people with substantial luggage. The half-dozen guys who were construction workers or baggage handlers all looked like islanders - large size. There were a couple of old ladies with shopping trollies. There were two people standing on the red floor at the front. There was only one fat elderley person sitting on each of the front seats behind the driver and next to the front door. I supposed a very thin and very pushy person could have insisted on sitting next to them.

I call that full.
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Re: Sydney airport traffic chaos

Postby Frosty » Thu Dec 07, 2017 10:58 pm

Though according to the VSTMs authorisation to carry sticker on the back it states 36 or 39 seats & 34 standing. I would call the above full though I’ve seen a VSTM filled right up the front door even leaning on it.

STA could be cheap rip out a few seats and simply trial a high density standing configuration with a standard 12.5m bus that would improve capacity & luggage space.
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Re: Sydney airport traffic chaos

Postby Swift » Fri Dec 08, 2017 1:44 am

Keep VSTMs off the 4 zero zero!!
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Re: Sydney airport traffic chaos

Postby Liamena » Fri Dec 08, 2017 8:20 pm

Don't some buses have an official standing limit of 15 ?
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