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Aviation unreliability

General Transport Discussion not specific to one state

Aviation unreliability

Postby Roderick Smith » Tue Oct 31, 2017 2:50 pm


October 30 2017 Flights between Canberra and Sydney most likely to be cancelled, new data shows .
Flights between Canberra and Sydney topped the nation for cancellations last month, with nearly two flights a day not running and concerns of wider problems on the route.
Department of Infrastructure and Regional Development statistics from September showed cancellations were highest on Canberra to Sydney and Sydney to Canberra flights at 8.1 per cent, ahead Sydney to Melbourne flights at 7.5 per cent and Melbourne to Sydney at 7.4 per cent.
More than 8 per cent of flights between Canberra and Sydney were cancelled.
There were 59 cancelled flights on both the Canberra to Sydney route and Sydney to Canberra, far higher than the 30 cancellations between Canberra and Melbourne in the same period.
In September, Qantas cancelled 32 flights from Sydney to Canberra, 6.8 per cent of its schedule for the month, while Virgin cancelled 27 flights, or 10.5 per cent.
Qantas cancelled 31 flights in the other direction, or 6.6 per cent, while Virgin cancelled 28 flights, or 10.9 per cent of its schedule.
Nationally, cancellations represented 2.7 per cent of all scheduled flights, up from 1.7 per cent a month earlier.
The national rate of cancellations was higher than the long term average of 1.4 per cent, the figures showed.
Nationally, airlines Jetstar, Qantas, QantasLink, Regional Express, Tiger, Virgin and Virgin Australia Regional averaged 79.3 per cent for on time arrivals in the month and 80.6 per cent for on time departures.
Frustrated travellers faced three cancelled Qantas flights in three hours on Thursday alone, with frustration added to by weather-related delays in Canberra.
Qantas ground crew at Sydney Airport told ticket holders the repeated delays for flights to the capital were caused by staffing shortages and competing priorities on other routes.
One passenger was told on the phone two cancellations in one day on the Sydney to Canberra route were caused by mechanical issues, before later being told by ground staff it was because Qantas didn't have enough crew members to fly on other routes.
Fairfax Media asked Qantas about the cancellations on Friday morning, but did not receive a response to questions from the airline.
A Virgin Australia spokeswoman said there were not ongoing problems on Sydney to Canberra route.
"Cancelling flights is never our preference but unfortunately we do occasionally need to change services due to adverse weather, operational requirements or other factors outside our control.
"We understand this can be frustrating for our guests and we appreciate their patience and understanding," she said.
In the 2016-17 financial year, the routes with the highest cancellation rates included leisure flights between Sydney and Hamilton Island at 5.0 per cent, followed by the Canberra and Sydney and Moranbah and Brisbane routes at 4.6 per cent.
The Sydney to Canberra route had 4.2 per cent cancellations, matched by Sydney to Melbourne, Melbourne to Sydney, Brisbane to Moranbah and Rockhampton to Brisbane routes.
By comparison in September, there were no cancelled flights between Canberra and Adelaide and three between Canberra and Brisbane.
Canberra Airport did not comment on the cancellation rates.
www.theage.com.au/act-news/flights-betw ... z9aak.html
* This is why we need high speed rail between Sydney, Canberra and Melbourne.
* no surprise. Whilst inconvient to passengers for sure it is easy for airlines to cancel flights CBR-SYD because there are so many flights in a day, is the effect to the airline is relatively minor. Effect to passenger different story of course.
Also the same aircraft is often used on the CBR-SYD router throughout the day, especially the dash 8’s, so cancelling a flight and keeping the aircraft on the ground can help the schedule later on in the day stay on track. Again inconvenient for the passenger on the cancelled fligh(s) but better for the airline and passengers later on in the day.
Very few routes elsewhere in the country have the combination of lots of (not so full) flights and same operating aircraft.
* High speed rail, the only answer.
* wish we had a fast train between Syd and Cbr
* When you are often scheduled for flights every 30 minutes, you have a system designed for flights to be cancelled to make it profitable.
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Re: Aviation unreliability

Postby Bjwh86 » Tue Nov 07, 2017 11:53 am

Even returning flights

This is current at time of post of tigerair Australia flight TT664 Canberra to Melbourne.Image

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Re: Aviation unreliability

Postby boronia » Tue Nov 07, 2017 12:12 pm

Going back a few years, it was not uncommon for flights on high frequency routes such as SYD-CBR and SYD-MEL to be cancelled due to low level of passenger bookings. Pax would be given the option of rebooking on earlier or later flights; this was done well before the likelihood of "operational issues" becoming the problem. Probably still happens, I had at least one Jetstar booking re-allocated a couple of years ago, about a week before the flight.
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Re: Aviation unreliability

Postby BroadGauge » Tue Nov 07, 2017 4:24 pm

Bjwh86 wrote:Even returning flights

This is current at time of post of tigerair Australia flight TT664 Canberra to Melbourne.

Not a great start to the week for Tigerair's Canberra services. Yesterday's TT662 (CBR to MEL) departed four hours late (I would know as I was on it) :twisted:
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Re: Aviation unreliability

Postby system improver » Tue Nov 07, 2017 4:26 pm

Planes refuse to stay in the air when their engines conk out.
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Re: Aviation unreliability

Postby boronia » Tue Nov 07, 2017 5:16 pm

Unless they are Irish?
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Re: Aviation unreliability

Postby 1whoknows » Sat Nov 18, 2017 11:27 am

Several factors are at work here. Firstly you have the pollies who fly in at the beginning of the week and out at the end but those seats are not needed during the rest of the week, Capacity is needed when there are gatherings of public servants from around the country in Canberra or when groups of Feds travel round the States but there is no consistency to this traffic - could be heaps on Tuesday and bugger all on Wednesday. Though you'd be amazed how many C/W -State meetings occur in Melb the day before or after Cup Day etc!! And similar in other states round big events. And this is public servants not just pollies.

High speed rail is currently non viable and is likely to remain so for several decades yet in my opinion. Cant see Roderick or myself making the trip in this lifetime.

However the express coach services, Murrays in particular, do very good business with hourly or better departures, a trip of not much more than three hours, and can easily scare up a coach for a second or third division when needed. The timing is probably only one hour more cbd to cbd than compared to a flight and two cbd/ airport transfers would be.

I frequently fly with Virgin and have never had a cancellation yet (probably just doomed myself for the next flight eh?) and not too much in the way of lateness unless its been general - like storms affecting all flights in and out of Sydney for example.

However on the several occasions I tried on Jetfail they cancelled or delayed every trip. One time they moved the flight earlier and forgot to email me!! They have incurred a permanent ban unless no other option is available. Have never tried Tiger so cant really comment about them but have heard some bad stories from others.
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Re: Aviation unreliability

Postby Tonymercury » Sat Nov 18, 2017 4:10 pm

boronia wrote:Unless they are Irish?

Good to see a very old joke revived!
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Re: Aviation unreliability

Postby Roderick Smith » Fri Nov 24, 2017 8:05 am

The system was universal on all of my recent USA, central and South America flights.
However, it is inefficient. Wave 2 trips over wave 1; then wave 3 trips over 1 & 2; wave 4 trips over the lot. The problem is getting past people loading suitcases (which should be in the hold) into lockers.


Nov 22 2017 British Airways boarding order: New 'pay least, board last' policy sparks anger.
British Airways has upset some people with a new policy of boarding passengers in order of how much they paid for the fare. Photo: Nick Morrish/British Airways
British Airways has divided opinion with a new "pay least, board last" policy that means passengers with the cheapest tickets will be last to hop on the aircraft.
As of December 12, all travellers flying within Europe will be assigned a group number between one and five at check-in, based on the fare they paid and their frequent flyer status.
Those in group one will include, unsurprisingly, first class flyers and Gold members of the British Airways Executive Club.
Group four passengers will comprise of Silver members, group three will be made up of Bronze status holders, and group four will include economy passengers. Right at the bottom of the pile will be those in group five, who have opted for BA's cheapest hand-luggage only fares.
Isn't this how boarding works already?
Yes, despite the social media outcry that erupted after the announcement was made on Friday.
First and business class flyers are always invited to board the plane first, with many airlines also giving priority to members of their loyalty program. Points mean prizes, after all.
BA says it's merely aiming to simplify a process already in place to enable faster boarding.
A spokesperson for the legacy airline said it was seeking to "improve the customer journey by creating a number of groups to speed up the process."
They added: "This method has been used by airlines around the world for a number of years, including by our partners American Airlines, Iberia and Qatar."
What about passengers with mobility issues or children?
Those who require special assistance or are travelling with young children will still be get priority and board first.
What are people so angry about?
Some pointed to that the fact that this grouping method is one already in use by the likes of Ryanair and EasyJet. And that apparently is not a good thing.
One respondent tweeted: "British Airways passengers to board in order of their ticket price. This would put Britain's flagship carrier on a par with Ryanair."
Another weighed in: "Think BA has lost the plot. Instead of competing with the Aldi and Lidl of the airline world they should have stuck to offering more and costing more. "
And one cried: "Nothing quite like a British class system to let you know your place!"
According to aviation expert John Strickland, it's just another way in which BA is evolving to stay competitive. He said: "Such changes will always divide opinion but BA is simply responding to the pressures of a short-haul market dominated by low-cost carriers who fly far more customers than it does."
Will this new "pay least, board last" system actually inspire people to shell out more for a ticket? Highly unlikely. But it might streamline the boarding process and cut delays.
Others responded more positively to the new policy.
"I shall enter triumphantly at the very end wearing a shirt that says 'Yay! I paid less than all you suckers'", tweeted one.
Another surmised: "If some idiot pays more to sit in a stationary plane waiting for those he considers socially inferior, so what?"
What is actually the fastest way to board a plane?
It's not what you think, nor a method employed by any airline. According to extensive research, it's actually quickest to allow passengers to board all at once and to choose their own seats – a method once favoured by Ryanair but abandoned in 2014 as part of its "family-friendly" facelift.
According to various studies, from sources as varied as Northwestern University in Illinois and the Discovery Channel's TV series MythBusters, this could save passengers up to 20 minutes of runway faffing on every return flight.
MythBusters, which devoted almost an entire show to the thorny problem last year, tested six options using a replica of an aircraft interior and 173 willing volunteers.
They found that the "no assigned economy seats" model resulted in a boarding time of 14 minutes, compared to the 24 minutes it took to board in zones from the back to the front of the plane, as per the industry standard.
So why don't airlines take heed? For one, passengers who like to take advantage of speedy boarding – and airlines like BA who take advantage of charging them for the privilege – would be scuppered. But the most glaringly obvious reason is that groups and families would – albeit temporarily – be split up.
Research has also suggested that baggage is the biggest factor when it comes to rapid boarding, while average boarding speeds have slowed from 20 passengers per minute in the 1960s to nine per minute in 1998 as use of hand luggage increased due to fees for checking bags.
The best option of all, according to Dr R. John Milne, of Clarkson University in New York, and set out in the Journal of Air Transport Management, would be for passengers with the most luggage to be given window seats and kept as far apart as possible, before boarding in a carefully choreographed order.
Whether BA's new system will speed things up or make boarding even slower remains to be seen.
See also: Why do passengers always board planes from the left hand side?
See also: The best seats in economy class and how to get them
London 'Telegraph' www.traveller.com.au/british-airways-bo ... ger-gzqi70
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