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Qantas quits Dubai

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Qantas quits Dubai

Postby Roderick Smith » Thu Aug 31, 2017 6:33 pm

Hooray. A horrible place, and forcing Qantas not to serve Pork on London flights.

Roderick.

August 31 2017 Goodbye to Dubai: Qantas shifts London stopovers to Singapore.
Qantas is dropping Dubai from its network and will instead have its Europe-bound aircraft stop over in Singapore, in a major shake-up that repositions it towards the booming Asian market.
The airline said on Thursday it would reroute its daily Sydney - London A380 service to fly via Singapore instead of Dubai from March 2018. That service will replace one of its two daily Sydney - Singapore A330 flights.
More videos 'Antidote to the tyranny of distance'
Qantas CEO, Alan Joyce puts a challenge to Airbus and Boeing to deliver an aircraft that can take passengers non-stop from Sydney to London by 2022.
Qantas had already announced its Melbourne - London service will fly non-stop to Europe out of Perth on its new Dreamliners starting in March, meaning the airline will not have any flights to Dubai.
Flights to Singapore from Melbourne are also being ramped up as part of the overhaul, with Qantas' daily service upgraded from a 235-seat A330 to a 484-seat A380 and its thrice weekly A330 service increased to a daily service.
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Melbourne passengers will have the option to transfer in Singapore onto a flight to London as an alternative to the 17-hour leg out of Perth.
Qantas codeshare partner Emirates will continue to fly 77 weekly services to its base in Dubai, connecting to destinations in Europe, the Middle East and Africa, which passengers will be able to book through Qantas.
The two airlines said on Thursday they would apply to the Australian Competition and Consumer Commission for a five-year extension to their alliance deal.
Qantas said it no longer needed to fly its own aircraft to Dubai as most of its passengers flew only to London and passengers flying elsewhere in Europe already flew their entire journey on Emirates.
Qantas has dropped Dubai from its network. Photo: Bloomberg
"That means we can redirect some of our A380 flying into Singapore and meet the strong demand we're seeing in Asia," chief executive Alan Joyce said.
Australia's biggest airline last said last week it was looking to do away with stop-overs en route to London all together, and had challenged manufacturers Airbus and Boeing to produce aircraft it could fly non-stop to the UK by 2022.
Qantas said the changes announced on Thursday would deliver it net benefits of more than $80 million a year from 2019.
www.theage.com.au/business/aviation/goo ... y7opr.html
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Re: Qantas quits Dubai

Postby rogf24 » Thu Aug 31, 2017 8:28 pm

The London-Melbourne flights now go via Perth. Perth probably going to suck compared to Dubai. Changi for Sydney passengers will be better than Dubai though. I don't think Dubai forced Qantas to drop pork off the menu, it was their own decision when they switched to Dubai. They probably wanted to localise, although you could argue the only localisation Qantas should do is Australian localisation but I don't really care. I just want to go from one airport to the other airport fed.
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Re: Qantas quits Dubai

Postby GeoffreyHansen » Mon Sep 04, 2017 2:49 pm

Part of me thinks this is a winding down of the partnership although I wish Qantas would still have connecting flights to other European centres themselves. Maybe they should have arranged for an A330 to go to Dubai.

I haven't been to Dubai but I get the feeling that Southeast Asia would be a more interesting stopover point although it's having direct flights from Perth to London.
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Re: Qantas quits Dubai

Postby simonl » Mon Sep 04, 2017 6:56 pm

Wasn't a lot of money spent on reorienting the network around the Emirates partnership? I never understood how it would work. They are apparently making a lot of money now. Perhaps that is in spite of the Emirates link up rather than because of it.

I expected the PER-LHR flights would be additional flights! Wow, a lot less seats to London on QF metal than 10 years ago.
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Re: Qantas aims for nonstop.

Postby Roderick Smith » Wed Sep 06, 2017 6:51 pm

Qantas could be ditching their international layovers sooner than you think . Sep 6 2017 .
Qantas could be scratching their layovers for longhaul flights. Photo: Shutterstock .
Are you ready to spend upwards of 20 hours sitting on a flight to London?
That's the new world order of non-stop flights that Qantas hopes will take wing in just five years' time.
Geared at time-pressured business travellers as well as holidaymakers who want to maximise their time on the ground, these direct flights will skip those stopovers in Dubai or Singapore to spend almost a full day getting you from A to B.
Qantas CEO Alan Joyce believes that the technology capable of making these non-stop flights will be available by 2022. Photo: Brendon Thorne .
Qantas expects the flights from Sydney, Melbourne and Brisbane to London will shave almost four hours off the time taken by such stopovers, with a shorter 18 hours non-stop to New York trimming the transit tally at LAX by three hours.
Direct flights to Paris, Rio de Janeiro and Cape Town are also mooted.
Pushing the limits in every way. They'll push the limits of technology – Airbus and Boeing have yet to design the jets capable of such long-legged trips, although Qantas CEO Alan Joyce says that both companies "believe they can create an aircraft by 2022 that will get that range."
Those flights will also push the limits of endurance, even if you're sitting in business class.
Let's take today's Qantas Business Suite, as seen on the airline's Airbus A330 jets and from later this year the Boeing 787 Dreamliner, as the benchmark.
From comfort to cocoon. The well-appointed seat is wide, comfortable and converts into a lie-flat bed. There's ample space around the seat for your laptop or tablet, books or magazines, plus a big-screen telly picked with videos including boxed-set TV shows.
Easily among the world's best business class seats, it has just about everything you could want to while away those many hours.
But how long does it get to reach the point where even the best seat becomes a confining cocoon? Even in a spacious first class suite such as Etihad's Airbus A380 Apartments, there's got to be a point at which you start to go a bit stir-crazy.
A chance to get social. That said, the inclusion of a social space where you can stretch your legs, change your surroundings and break up the journey – a lounge or bar – becomes a welcome respite from spending so many hours in that same seat.
I've enjoyed slabs of time spend relaxing in the sky-high business class bars of the A380s from Qatar (my favourite), Etihad and Emirates, as well as Virgin Australia's Boeing 777 jets to Los Angeles. It's quite astounding how a few hours chatting with fellow travellers over a drink can help time pass so quickly.
Even so: 20 hours to London? That's one long trip, and it's got me in two minds.
The thrill of experience. I enjoy the current stopover in Dubai, although if you have access to the superb first class lounge of partner Emirates that stopover is admittedly too brief and feels too rushed. However, I was among the first to cheer Qantas' return to Singapore as the hub for its London flights from March next year.
Non-stop to New York, for me, is a simpler proposition. Having to transit at LAX remains a right pain, primarily due to need to retrieve and re-check your luggage as well as sometimes change terminals depending on who your onwards flight is with.
My preference for travelling to New York these days is not Qantas but Cathay Pacific, because I can fly from Sydney to Hong Kong and then straight through to Gotham.
My checked luggage goes straight through from Sydney to New York, and if I've got to have a stop-over I'd rather it be in Hong Kong with its excellent business class and first class lounges and even the opportunity to break my journey for a day or two.
Few people spend more time on planes, in lounges or mulling over the best ways to use frequent flyer points than David Flynn, the editor of Australian Business Traveller magazine. His unparalleled knowledge of all aspects of business travel connects strongly with the interests of Executive Style readers.
What's your current airline of choice for flights from Australia to London and New York, and are you ready to make the switch from stopovers to an 18-20 non-stop flight?
See Also:
The designer trend about to hit business class .
Virgin's new battle for business class .
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Maximise and minimise.
www.executivestyle.com.au/qantas-could- ... ink-gybmfi
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Re: Qantas quits Dubai

Postby Merc1107 » Thu Sep 07, 2017 6:27 pm

Passed through Dubai twice, once on an outbound trip and then on a return trip with Emirates.

Can't really understand the fuss about Emirates or Dubai. While it wasn't a bad experience, both are completely overhyped. Service aboard was quite variable and the food, even by economy standards, pretty lacklustre.

Visited the USA some years ago now. I was headed to Texas, but despite trying to book three months in advance, the QF system didn't want to offer me the direct flight to Dallas/Fort-Worth. In the end, I scrapped the idea and booked with Japan Airlines (which landed me a flight to Sydney on QF, to Narita on JAL, then a Transpacific flight with American Airlines) as they worked out about $300 cheaper than QF for the whole journey.
Admittedly, this was the long way, but service aboard JAL was exceptional (if a bit quirky), and even American had friendly, experienced crew, and most of all, plenty of food and snacks for economy passengers.

Would I transit in the Middle East again? No. For Perth to London, it simply means you have the longer flight first as opposed to last. For lesser destinations on either end, it may mean an extra stop, a long wait or otherwise.

And would I use a Qantas non-stop service from Australia? You'd have to PAY me to sit in Qantas economy for that sort of time. I'd be hoping for a lot more than 31.5" of pitch, that's for sure.
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Re: Long-haul international

Postby Roderick Smith » Sun Sep 10, 2017 12:21 pm

Roderick

September 9 2017 Fly longer, but the airport transfer is not departing just yet .
For all the hardships of long-distance travel, stopping mid-journey at an unfamiliar airport to change planes is generally accepted as one of the more trying.
So two pieces of news from Australia's largest airline created quite the stir among frequent flyers.
More videos 'Antidote to the tyranny of distance'.
Qantas CEO, Alan Joyce puts a challenge to Airbus and Boeing to deliver an aircraft that can take passengers non-stop from Sydney to London by 2022.
Firstly, Qantas will drop Dubai from its network early next year and reroute flights from Sydney to London to stop in Singapore instead.
And in the not too distant future the airline hopes it won't have to stop anywhere at all, with chief executive Alan Joyce outlining plans to fly non-stop from Australia's east-coast to London and New York by 2022.
In doing so he put Qantas at the pointy end of a trend that has the potential to upend global aviation, as a new generation of aircraft threatens the model which underpins how we travel.
To the point. The cornerstone of long-haul aviation for decades has been the "spoke and hub" model: gather all your passengers in a central point (like Sydney or London), put them on a large aeroplane like a Boeing 747 or an Airbus A380 and fly them to another well-connected hub (say Hong Kong or Los Angeles).
From there, passengers can board smaller planes to travel to their final destination.
This has been a boon for well-placed hubs like Singapore and Hong Kong - traditionally where flights from Australia to Europe stopped off to refuel.
Qantas' new 787 Dreamliner will fly the non-stop Perth to London route, but the airline wants planes that can go even further.
Airports in the Persian Gulf later emerged as a competitor through the late 1990s and 2000s, becoming popular stop-over points on flights between continents and driving the growth in their local airlines: Emirates, Etihad and Qatar.
"These major Asian hubs have really suffered from the gulf carriers," says Peter Harbison, executive chairman of the industry intelligence firm CAPA - Centre for Aviation.
Qantas will drop Dubai International Airport from its network from March 2018. Photo: EschCollection "Singapore Airlines has been languishing because of low-cost local short-haul entrants, but also because Emirates has been vacuuming away a lot of its transfer traffic."
Last week Qantas said it was altering its Sydney to London service to stop in Singapore instead of Dubai from March 2018.
New aircraft mean carriers can bypass stopover points. But hub carriers like Emirates have a cost advantage if fuel rises, experts say. Photo: AP Its Melbourne-Dubai-London flights were already set to be routed through Perth when it starts its non-stop London service in March, meaning Dubai will disappear from Qantas' network entirely.
Rico Merkert, an air transport expert and professor at the University of Sydney, said Qantas' decision was a blow for Dubai as competition between the hubs was fierce.
"A lot their economies are built around those airports," Merkert says.
"Yes they want you to connect there, but ideally they want you to spend a couple of days there. They're trying to grow their tourism, and both are very important trade hubs."
Qantas will maintain its code-sharing arrangement with Emirates under an extension of the deal that saw the "Kangaroo Route" move to the United Arab Emirates from Singapore five years ago, as it tried to stem the flow of cash hemorrhaging from its international arm.
Harbison suspects the Gulf carrier would have extracted its "pound of flesh" in exchange for Qantas dropping its home base. (The airlines wouldn't provide details).
Virgin Australia has meanwhile secured slots at the crowded Hong Kong airport, with plans to build on its daily flights to and from Melbourne and using it as a hub to tap into the lucrative Chinese market, with flights connecting to mainland China through its code-share partner Hong Kong Airlines.
Don't stop. But a new generation of jetliners that fly longer, use less fuel and carry fewer people are presenting an alternative to the hub model by making it possible - and economical - to fly non-stop between new city pairs.
United Airlines, for example, on Friday announced it would fly 787-9 Dreamliners between Sydney and Houston, a route not previously served, while Air Canada last week unveiled a year-round Melbourne to Vancouver service, also on Dreamliners. And Chinese carriers have added a slew of new non-stop services to Australia from cities like Hangzhou and Shenzhen.
Qantas will use 787-9s on its 17-hour non-stop route from Perth to London, starting in March next year, carrying just 236 passengers on the 14,498 kilometre journey - fewer than half the 484 seats on the A380s Qantas flies to London from Sydney.
And the airline has tasked airline manufactures with providing planes that can fly non-stop from Australia's east coast to destinations like London, New York, Paris, Cape Town, and Rio de Janeiro.
It should be easy enough for Boeing and Airbus' to make their latest aircraft (the 777X and the A350) go the distances Qantas wants by reducing their payloads (generally done by putting in fewer passengers), says Richard Aboulafia, vice president of analysis at Teal Group, an aerospace consultancy based in Virginia.
But he says the economics of long haul "point to point" travel will largely rest on the price of fuel.
"Very long haul aircraft are guilty of self tanking: you have to carry more fuel in order to carry the additional fuel that you're carrying, which weighs you down even more," he says.
"If fuel is $40 a barrel it's not all the important. If it's $70 or $80 it becomes ruinous."
Departure time?
Qantas expects to be able to squeeze a premium from time-hungry corporate travellers on its non-stop flights, and has geared its cabins to be heavy with business class seats.
"[But] that additional revenue better outweigh the additional cost of flying a plane that's stuffed to the gills with fuel," says Aboulafia.
Fuel is an airline's biggest single cost, and price fluctuations can wreak havoc on a carrier's balance sheet.
Qantas, for example, spent $3.03 billion on fuel in the 2017 financial year but $4.59 billion in 2014, when a barrel of oil was about twice the price it is today.
The $1.4 billion difference in fuel expenses is the same size as Qantas' entire underlying profit last year.
Aboulafia says that is where airlines like Emirates have an advantage with their central stopover and refuelling points - they won't need to carry as much fuel at any one time, creating savings they can pass on to passengers.
Merkert agrees that flying through stop-over hubs will remain the best option for cost-conscious Australian travellers, particularly holidaymakers.
"Although Emirates is not a low-cost carrier, if they can fill those A380s on the trunk route every day, then they are fairly low cost and they can use that cost advantage in terms offering customers lower [fares]," he says.
Harbison says the hub airport operators aren't facing an existential threat just yet. There aren't enough of the long-haulers around yet, he says, and new point-to-point routes create more passengers and don't necessarily steal them from existing routes.
"But give it five years, and it'll be a different equation."
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http://www.theage.com.au/business/aviat ... ydd51.html
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